Divemaster Responsibilities

[InTheDrink]

My solution to that is to start giving the handout I wrote and posted on this board under the new divers and those considering forum to every one of my students. And based on the PM's I've been receiving asking for permission to use it a number of others are doing it as well. Maybe not as a handout but as part of their club's or shop's website. Again anyone who wishes may use it. I only ask that you send me a link to your site so I can see it and you provide a link to mine and in return I'll provide a link to yours.

Jim Lapenta
Welcome to UDM Aquatic Services

Jim,
Agreed. But your post, at best, is only going to reach divers that were already likely to be taught well. Otherwise they'd never receive your post. I agree, it's a great start.

But how to reach the rest - maybe the majority I don't know - of new divers???

 

[Thalassamania]

1) Make Jim's piece a sticky
2) Recruit all new divers Scubaboard

 

[bsee65]

What do you think would happen if a copy of the sheet were handed to LDS owners? Would they post it or think it was a bad idea?

 

[Thalassamania]

I think that most would be happy to give it to the dives that finished a course, those about to take a course might be another question.

 

[ScubaSteve]

.....if they so choose.

I think it is important that we do not lose sight of these words. The DM can do everything "right" with a group of X people, turn to point to a fish only to have someone swim off into the abyss in the other direction.

Nothing is foolproof to a sufficiently talented fool.

This I am sure does not apply here (i.e. the incident that started this conversation) but as this conversation continues, we must know that this will always apply no matter what. So, we work around that knowledge and come up with the best available. I have made it clear that I believe every aspect of this trio (Operator, DM and Diver) should have some responsibility but in the end, things can still happen.

 

[bsee65]

Gents, a discussion about what should be covered in training an OW diver is a worthy topic but the focus here, in this thread, is THAT accident and what went wrong once he finished his ow cert dives IN CAYMAN and what the diver, dive op and DM/DG did wrong. We all know that the newly minted diver is looking for guidance, is awed by it all, and assumes the man leading the dive is leading them to a safe site that is within the PADI recommendations. As I said before, the new diver is overwhelmed at that moment, HIS FIRST DIVE POST CERT, and does not REALLY even know the right questions to ask. Could we keep this discussion, in this thread, to the Cayman accident chain of events and perhaps start a different thread that addresses the worthy training aspect?

I think it's time for me to lurk in this thread and give other people, with fresh ideas, a chance to explore the range of tragic mistakes that led to this divers death.

Actually, this thread devolved into an argument many pages ago and found its way to the obscure "Whine and Cheese" board. It is now in the Basic Scuba discussion because there are lessons to be learned for the beginning diver from the discussion, especially with a fatal incident as punctuation. This thread has grown beyond a single incident, and I think that's quite reasonable under the circumstances.

 

[Dtaine]

Yes. The real problem isn't that the guy had bad judgement, it's that he was taken to a location where bad judgement is fatal instead of a place where bad judgement is annoying.

If I take someone to a shooting range and they shoot themselves in the foot is that my fault?

Look, I'm not saying the DM doesn't have some level of responsibility, he might. However, the idea that all or most of the blame, as some have suggested, lies on him and not the diver is absurd to me.

 

[Docc]

If I take someone to a shooting range and they shoot themselves in the foot is that my fault?

Sadly, in the litigious times we live in, it's your fault, the weapon manufacturer's fault, the range owner (and all employees) fault, the ammunition manufacturer's fault, and probably the fault of the unsafe footwear that allowed the round to penetrate to the foot.

 

[Web Monkey]

If I take someone to a shooting range and they shoot themselves in the foot is that my fault?

That depends on who you brought along. If you take someone brand new to a range, I would expect that you would do your best to keep him from pointing the business end in bad directions. If you took a cop to a gun range, I'd figure he knows what to do and is on his own.

Look, I'm not saying the DM doesn't have some level of responsibility, he might. However, the idea that all or most of the blame, as some have suggested, lies on him and not the diver is absurd to me.

I'm not PADI certified, and could be wrong, but as far as I know, current PADI OW training does not require demonstrating buoyancy control in an environment without a visible bottom (not really sure if they actually require any at all). There's no reason to believe that the guy had the capacity to maintain depth on a wall.

If the OP had even a handful of dives and had demonstrated some sort of buoyancy control and judgement, I'd say "The DM was a moron, but the guy did it to himself.", and call it a day. That isn't the case here.

A reasonable DM who is handed an unknown 2-dive diver would be under the boat verifying/practicing skills (including hovering) and looking at cool fish for the first dive before going anywhere dangerous. The experienced divers would be told "Remember where the boat is and come back before you run out of air."

Terry

 

[Riger]

I'm not PADI certified, and could be wrong, but as far as I know, current PADI OW training does not require demonstrating buoyancy control in an environment without a visible bottom

Terry,

I got my training 18 months ago and never did the buoyancy control "in the blue". The best thing we (wifey and I) did was consolidate our training with an additional 10 dives immediately after the course.

Best Regards
Richard