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DiveMaster insurance options...

Discussion in 'Dive Insurance' started by Kfay, Oct 7, 2019.

  1. Kfay

    Kfay Angel Fish

    # of Dives: 200 - 499
    Location: Florida
    65
    6
    8
    Hey, I am inquiring about options for DM insurance. I see Dan has a policy for $398 and V&B is similar... What other options are there? Do any of the big insurance companies have some sort of policy or is this it? If this is it seems like a huge ripoff.
     
  2. mcohen1021

    mcohen1021 Manta Ray

    # of Dives: 1,000 - 2,499
    Location: Texas
    946
    471
    63
    This is one of the reasons I have not been an active DM since around 2000.
     
  3. wetb4igetinthewater

    wetb4igetinthewater Instructor, Scuba

    # of Dives: 500 - 999
    Location: Seattle
    3,962
    2,315
    113
    We do take a huge responsibility when teaching/guiding underwater, hence the expensive liability insurance. My guess is that if most pros realized the costs associated with teaching and how little they would earn teaching through shops, they may not go that route.
     
    rjack321 likes this.
  4. Kfay

    Kfay Angel Fish

    # of Dives: 200 - 499
    Location: Florida
    65
    6
    8
    I don't blame you... I am just trying to be a part-time DM because I like it but not if thats the cost. I would be working for free practically. I am hoping to find a cheaper option.
     
  5. rjack321

    rjack321 Captain

    # of Dives: 1,000 - 2,499
    Location: Port Orchard, WA
    9,276
    3,244
    113
    ~$400 is about what you are going to pay.

    When you see agency's throw their own instructors under the bus even when they follow the written standards you'll understand this is all part of the game.
    Agencies outsource the risk and costs to instructors and DMs.
    Don't have any incentive to revise even the riskiest standards (have you seen the DSD ratio threads?).
    Shops push high ratio classes - they're within standards right?
    Most of the time they go "just fine"
    Occasionally there is a problem, possibly even a fatality
    Blame the instructor/DM - oh well they are replaceable
    Repeat expectations that instructors and DMs foot the bill for ever escalating liability coverage.

    There's a continual crop of new instructors and DMs who buy into this asinine business model to "live the dream"

    Don't work for free. You are worth more than that and you run the risk of losing everything for a temporary nugget of DM prestige.
     
  6. wetb4igetinthewater

    wetb4igetinthewater Instructor, Scuba

    # of Dives: 500 - 999
    Location: Seattle
    3,962
    2,315
    113
    Oh man, when I crossed over to SSI, my IT (former shop manager, GUE's "biggest fan" :wink:) reminded me that SSI requires each instructor must have an emergency action plan for each dive site for where they teach.

    Since I was at a shop chain, I asked, "So does <shop name> have ones for each dive site where courses are taught?" (there are not that many dive sites used for training in the Puget Sound.

    IT answers "Oh no, the shop would never assume that kind of liability!"

    So the max an instructor would get for open water is $50 per student, we already pay our own insurance and agency fees, and the shop doesn't even want to address a possible issue. The risk/reward ratio is completely out of whack.

    Yeah, I like being independent.

    Now in hindsight, if I wasn't going to open a dive op for an early/active retirement in Greece, there's no way I'd become an instructor.

    To be fair, there is one instructor in our area that has two training deaths and is still teaching from what I've heard.
     
    Esprise Me and rjack321 like this.
  7. JackD342

    JackD342 Dive Shop

    # of Dives: 500 - 999
    Location: Highland Park, IL
    2,427
    1,430
    113
    At least V&B offers a shop policy that can include multiple staff for no added cost per head. You might be able to find a shop that uses that option and would be willing to add you to their policy. You would only be covered for that shop's activities.

    The one caution is policy limits. If an incident involves multiple staff in that one policy, the dollar limits are an aggregate for the shop coverage, and not applied "per person". So multiple individuals with individual policies in the same incident would often have have better coverage, depending on coverage level the shop has purchased.
     
  8. Kfay

    Kfay Angel Fish

    # of Dives: 200 - 499
    Location: Florida
    65
    6
    8
    So I guess to answer my question there is only V&B, and DAN in the US? Off-topic but V&B is in desperate need of a website overhaul...
     
  9. tursiops

    tursiops Marine Scientist and Master Instructor ScubaBoard Supporter

    # of Dives: 2,500 - 4,999
    Location: U.S. East Coast
    8,421
    6,133
    113
    Their response to emails and phone calls is very good.
     
  10. Kfay

    Kfay Angel Fish

    # of Dives: 200 - 499
    Location: Florida
    65
    6
    8
    That is good to know. I was not saying the service is bad by any means.
     

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