Dive lights questions

[SapphireMind]

I'm with @Zef . For night diving, even in Monterey waters, the average dive light (i.e.., decent power, fixed beam width that's neither video-wide nor laser-narrow) will work great. Adjustable beam is an amazing feature, but keep in mind that people having been doing those kinds of dives without adjustable beams since the dawn of scuba. I would be interested to see how many people who have been using adjustable-beam dive lights actually find that feature important; oh, they may use the feature because they have it (and paid dearly for it) and, well, it's kinda fun, but how important is it really? The vast majority of divers do not have adjustable-beam lights for regular ol' night diving. In cave and wreck environments where you sometimes want to light up a room, adjustable-beam lights are more the norm (and even then, I would wager many cave divers rarely adjust the beam), but for night diving in open water, it's a bell/whistle feature and you're going to pay a lot for it. It's not envy--I am on a training path for tech diving, and I have an expensive adjustable-beam light and rarely adjust it. For night diving in open water, I use a DGX 600. Maybe if I were diving west coast waters rather than clear topical waters I would take the expensive light instead, but I would consider it a nice thing to use, not a necessary one.

On the topic of accidentally dropping a light into the abyss or flooding a light, if it's a $60 light as opposed to a $600 light, you just shrug it off, pull out your backup and continue the dive, then buy a replacement without burning a hole in your wallet.

You're a relatively new diver and, with all due respect, can't predict what you're going to like and dislike. Why not buy a pair of simple lights for the time being, and if it so happens that you just fall in love with night diving in Monterey and similar environments, then buy an expensive, adjustable-power, adjustable-beam light, and relegate your original lights to backup duty?

I completely agree with all this - my only question is what's a good degree for being being video-wide and laser-narrow? LOL Is 8-9 degrees too narrow?

I've really appreciated all the discussion and feedback on this topic. It's always hard to know when you're starting out which things are worth investing in up-front and which are worth doing cheapos until you find what you actually like. My kit has a lot of work needed, I still rent some stuff.

I know I need some lanyards for my lights, my slate/compass, dive tool/knife - should I get some extra if I can just for other things that might come up? I'm definitely more nervous adding more equipment as there is more to go wrong/get distracted by and I'm very conservative on the safety side (one of the reasons I do one-on-one instruction for new skills) I want to feel as prepared as possible prior to diving. What are peoples favorites in store bought lanyards? (I'm not at a place to make my own at this point)

 

[wetb4igetinthewater]

I know I need some lanyards for my lights, my slate/compass, dive tool/knife - should I get some extra if I can just for other things that might come up? I'm definitely more nervous adding more equipment as there is more to go wrong/get distracted by and I'm very conservative on the safety side (one of the reasons I do one-on-one instruction for new skills) I want to feel as prepared as possible prior to diving. What are peoples favorites in store bought lanyards? (I'm not at a place to make my own at this point)

I’m envisioning a Christmas tree right now. You want to streamline your configuration as much as possible. Wrist mounted compass, wrist slates, cutting tool should be mounted where you can reach it with both hands.

You should have only one thing on a lanyard in my opinion.

 

[Zef]

I completely agree with all this - my only question is what's a good degree for being being video-wide and laser-narrow? LOL Is 8-9 degrees too narrow?

I've really appreciated all the discussion and feedback on this topic. It's always hard to know when you're starting out which things are worth investing in up-front and which are worth doing cheapos until you find what you actually like. My kit has a lot of work needed, I still rent some stuff.

I know I need some lanyards for my lights, my slate/compass, dive tool/knife - should I get some extra if I can just for other things that might come up? I'm definitely more nervous adding more equipment as there is more to go wrong/get distracted by and I'm very conservative on the safety side (one of the reasons I do one-on-one instruction for new skills) I want to feel as prepared as possible prior to diving. What are peoples favorites in store bought lanyards? (I'm not at a place to make my own at this point)

I think you are overthinking this way too much...wide beam/narrow beam...Just get a torch....if you are doing your night dive(s) as part of certification class there will be other Jedis wielding their light sabers under the water making up for anything your torch does not cover. There really is no perfect beam angle unless you have specific needs for photography but then this discussion would have a much more technical flavor to it. Things that I find more relevant to torches for recreational use are whether the reflector is crenelated or smooth and how long the burn time is....I find crenelated reflectors give better light dispersion...but most of the torches I have come across have smooth reflectors, and if you are going to do more than one dive where you will use the torch then you will want one with a burn time long enough to cover your activities or have spare batteries to swap in.

I carry a torch on every dive but I rarely use it to illuminate the environment...the local diving here often has challenging visibility...the torch is used more as a way for me to signal to my dive partner than to see where I am going. I guess I have been diving in crappy vis conditions for so long that I have accommodated to it from an illumination standpoint. In silty water the beam tends to get reflected back/around when it hits the silt kinda like high beams on a car during a snowstorm. In clear water anything will work relatively ok irrespective of beam angle. This seems like a really important detail but for general use it really is not.

Regarding lanyards....I recommend getting some extendable coil lanyards...attach one to your primary torch and clip it to your bc. If you have a smaller backup torch then stowe it with a simple wrist loop attached in your BC or wetsuit pocket.

Slates are another thing that seem like a good idea...and they are in certain situations....as a new diver you will most likely not have the buoyancy control to be fiddling with a slate while maintaining your position in the water column and you will either float up or sink down and possibly endager yourself and the reef/diving environment in the process. The slate will just be hanging there taking up space and will most likely go relatively unused. In my years of diving I have only really found a slate to be useful when I know that I am going to compass navigate between numerous objectives underwater, in this case I will jot down the bearings between objectives because my brain will not allow me to remember anything past the second bearing that I need to swim towards. Most of the time the slate is left hanging on the rack in the garage or stowed with any spare gear I bring in the car. In the rare case that you need to write a note to your dive partner on a slate the issue will most likely be overcome by the time it takes you to write and hand the slate off to your partner....it would be much more effective to have a thorough pre-dive discussion with your partner on what hand signals the two of you will use and what they indicate...when all else fails and there is a true sense of urgency or you notice something that needs imediate attention due to safety then you can always signal to end the dive and head to the surface....this is something that I have found rarely needs to occur.

Your focus should be on obtaining experience instead of gear. Mask, fins, BC, regulator, exposure suit, computer....and a compass....I never dive without a compass.

-Z

 

[Lorenzoid]

I completely agree with all this - my only question is what's a good degree for being being video-wide and laser-narrow? LOL Is 8-9 degrees too narrow?

I'm no expert, but from Googling a few lights, I get the impression that anything in the range of 8-12 degrees is a "normal" light of the type that would work fine for OW night diving. The narrower end of this range is likely a compromise to appeal both to OW night divers and to tech divers who want a narrower beam for signaling. There appear to be a few with a 6 degree beam that would probably appeal mainly to cave divers who rely on their lights for signaling. Also, keep in mind that lights generally have a wider halo around a center "hot spot."

There are some pics of beams in this thread: Review: DGX 600 vs Xtar D26 vs $22 eBay light

 

[SapphireMind]

I think you are overthinking this way too much

I excel at overthinking things It's a specialty! But some of this is required gear for certs. I have actually pretty good buoyancy - Still not perfect, but better than my experience would say - I've taken a buoyancy class and spent time just working on that in the water. I'm a perfectionist. But these dives are for my navigation, night and deep diving specialties. I have a hard time getting off work to go to Monterey (and don't have a car) so I have taken the didactic classes and then we're doing the dives over a long weekend I have off.

I tend to excessively plan, because then I can plan for when plans fail, and when those plans fail, etc. Personality quirk that happens to be a positive trait in my career (neonatology). Detail oriented, obsessive, perfectionist - we're a fun bunch LOL Basically, I want to know what to expect in a normal circumstance, because then I can recognize faster when I'm not in that and might need to take action. Some days I wish other people could see inside my brain. I would make so much more sense!

 

[Zef]

I excel at overthinking things It's a specialty!

For the record it was not a criticism. I totally understand. And what you commented on planning...I recall a discussion with the captain of my last ship, he was asked by one of our sailors "why do we form and brief these elaborate plans when we know they are going to change and not be followed"...his response was that "we make plans so that we know how far we strayed from what we expected to unfold in the final analysis of an exercise or operation".

I wish you luck earning your certifications, I would wager you will do fine.

Cheers,

-Z

 

[JamesBon92007]

I don't do a lot of night diving but a few months ago I mounted two cheap video lights ("Shoot" brand, under $20 ea. on ebay) on my video tray and never even turned on my main flashlight. I also have a small backup light so out of four lights I only used the two video lights. They have two power settings and will go for about 1 1/2 hours on high and 5 hours on low. Low was plenty of light for swimming around looking at stuff. I also use the video lights in the daytime to restore the colors in my videos.

 

[Brian G]

I'm fond of small lights that use a rechargeable 18650 battery. I have a focusable light, but I always use it on the narrowest setting, so I would opt for a non-focusing light if I did it over. Dive Rite makes a BX2 light that is simple and rugged for $100. Only one setting though. This one from Mako is pretty inexpensive with a hi-low-strobe https://www.makospearguns.com/970-Lumen-Dive-Light-p/m970dl.htm. It's made by Orcatorch, who seems to make a lot of other-brand lights. I trust twist-on lights a bit more than push-buttons, but you lose your multiple settings.
Since you like to research, I'll add some more data points.
For a particular LED size, a larger reflector is required for narrower focus. This is not to say that a larger reflector WILL focus more narrowly, just that physics allows it. If you see a light with a small reflector that claims a very narrow focus, they are likely exaggerating. Some lights use lenses to focus; these are not comparable to a reflector lights in this respect (it is possible to design a lens that will focus narrower than a same-size reflector).
Alkaline batteries are not designed for high-current use. For a modern LED to output 1000 lumens, it needs about 3 amps of current. Energizer C-cells have a capacity of 8000 mAh (milli-amp hours) when they are outputting 25 mA, but are rated only 4000 mAh at 500 mA. They are not rated for 3 amps of output. Lithium-ion batteries ARE designed for high-current use. 3 amps is child's play. A single 18650 lithium-ion (18650 is the physical size of 18mm diameter x 65mm length) will output 3 amps longer than 3 alkaline c-cells. I'm not sure how technical you want to get, but the end result is that a 1000 lumen light is best powered by lithium-ion. The downside of lithium-ion is that there are a lot of fake batteries on the market, even many sold by Amazon. Budgetlightforum.com is the place to look for who is selling legit batteries.

 

[JamesBon92007]

Just buy a cheap light in the 1k lumen range that uses a standard battery you can replace such as an 18650. There are only a few light manufactures so don't get caught up in the brand names.

Here is an example. It doesn't have a battery which I view as a plus since you can buy a high quality 18650 for it.

https://rover.ebay.com/rover/0/0/0?mpre=https://www.ebay.com/ulk/itm/113258667717

How does a push-button magnetic switch operate? Mine are either rotary or a lever so I understand how the switch works, but a button? It seems like something has to move the magnet...

I have a couple of these:

Flashlight 2000LM Diving CREE XM-L T6 3W aa LED Waterproof Torch Underwater Lamp 763293672759 | eBay

I've had one on at least a hundred dives and it still works perfectly. It uses four AA batteries. The first set was still going strong after 50 dives (using it only occasionally) and I replaced them because I figured they would probably quit on me but hadn't yet. I use it in my pool, in the rain, for going on walks, working on plumbing, etc. It's my #1 home flashlight. A while back I put some old NiMh batteries in it and they just keep going too. I might not recommend it for cave diving but for looking in holes and under ledges while diving it's AOK. I also wouldn't recommend buying from an ebayer with a 96% rating It's made out of plastic so I wouldn't recommend dropping it or setting a tank on it, but I don't baby it either. Mine has been down past 90 feet on a few occasions but I don't see any reason why it wouldn't go a lot deeper.

 

[MAKO Spearguns]

Thanks for the positive comments above. The 970 MAKO light has been very well received and we have had nearly 100% positive feedback. It throws a powerful and focused beam that works well in the day and at night.

As an FYI, we also sell a wide angle light which is specifically intended for video use. We do NOT recommend this lght as a primary night diving light, particularly if you are diving in less than perfect visibility. A focused light will cut through the murk, while a wide angle light will light up a big sphere of glowing dirty water in front of you and this is detrimental to your "night vision" and ability to see. Not so different from using your high beams in the fog. Possibly this has been mentioned, I didn't read the entire thread.

thanks
dano