Dive Computers....

[rjchandler]

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not rely on something that can be lost or damaged during the dive (have a battery go dead, flood, et cetera).

My brain has done all these things. Just ask my ex-wife

Seriuosly - the answer to the guys question is that computers are not DIR but it isn't because of possible damage to or loss of the computer. BottomTimers present the same risks.

As to the air consumption calcs - you still have a timing device, a depth measuring device and a pressure measuring device. You do a bunch of averages in your head and figure your consumption that way.

 

[Curt Bowen]

Curt - DIR's not just about technical diving. As someone like Mo2vation could testify, there are a large number of recreational only DIR divers.

That being said, most still wouldn't use computers.

Incorrect, I just returned from a deep cave expedition in Cay Sal along with multiple rebreather expeditions to Exumas, Coco's and here in florida.

Everyone on each expedition used a computer for their decompression obligations. Tables were cut for emergency bail out only incase the computer craps out (none did).

The days of tables are over, VR3 technology is here and is very safe.

The Explorer computer and Dive Rites HE is available also

Recreation DIR divers should also be using a computer to maximize their bottom times.

 

[polkster13]

Actually, the dive computer he put his link to does not mount on your wrist. It is integrated into a mask. I would think that any device that was that important should be mounted on the wrist so you wouldn't accidently lose it and it would be easily viewable from there. I agree that you can damage a bottom timer but since it is mounted to your wrist it is very unlikely that you would "lose" it. You could not say the same thing if the bottom timer was mounted in your mask.

I was not saying that this was the reason it was not DIR but only pointing out the fact that a mask can be dislodged from your face a lot easier than having a computer or depth gauge come off of your wrist.

So for argument sake, let us say their is a manufacturer that puts a bottom timer in a mask. Bottom timers are DIR approved. Would the fact that the bottom timer is now in your mask and not on your wrist make it NOT dir approved? I would think so because if you lose your mask you also lose your bottom timer.

If I am wrong in this assumption, then someone please correct me.

 

[Boogie711]

Incorrect, I just returned from a deep cave expedition in Cay Sal along with multiple rebreather expeditions to Exumas, Coco's and here in florida.

Everyone on each expedition used a computer for their decompression obligations. Tables were cut for emergency bail out only incase the computer craps out (none did).

The days of tables are over, VR3 technology is here and is very safe.

The Explorer computer and Dive Rites HE is available also

Recreation DIR divers should also be using a computer to maximize their bottom times.

Curt, that's NOT my point. My point, really simply - Just because someone is DIR doesn't mean they're a technical diver. Therefore, they don't need 'tech' computers. Or any computer, for that matter. And claiming that DIR divers should also be using a computer to "maximize their bottom times" is not only unnecessary, it's not a DIR answer, so therefore, shouldn't be in a DIR forum.

Furthermore, are you claiming that you just completed a rebreather expedition with DIR divers wearing computers?

I doubt it very much.

 

[cnidae]

Incorrect, I just returned from a deep cave expedition in Cay Sal along with multiple rebreather expeditions to Exumas, Coco's and here in florida.

Everyone on each expedition used a computer for their decompression obligations. Tables were cut for emergency bail out only incase the computer craps out (none did).

The days of tables are over, VR3 technology is here and is very safe.

The Explorer computer and Dive Rites HE is available also

Recreation DIR divers should also be using a computer to maximize their bottom times.

Curt, the computers you pointed out are worthless to this type of diving. We use simple rules of thumbs to calculate our decompression for any depth and any bottom time. All those computers would be doing would be giving us info we already know, so why waist the money? Since I started diving DIR I've yet to use a table. There are more points why we don't use computers but I'll let someone else answer those.

 

[MarcHall]

Dive computers are not part of the DIR philosophy or gear configuration.

A simple bottom timer providing depth and time info is part of the DIR philosophy and gear configuration.

The use of standardized bottom gases and deco mixes to simplify the mixing of the gases, the dive planning and ascent profiles are part of the DIR philosophy.

I have not cut or used tables to determine my ascent profiles in quite awhile, preferring to use a simple rules based system and knowledge of what the shape of the ascent profile should like to generate the ascent profile used for each dive.

Marc Hall
www.enjoythedive.com

 

[Curt Bowen]

Curt, that's NOT my point. My point, really simply - Just because someone is DIR doesn't mean they're a technical diver. Therefore, they don't need 'tech' computers. Or any computer, for that matter. And claiming that DIR divers should also be using a computer to "maximize their bottom times" is not only unnecessary, it's not a DIR answer, so therefore, shouldn't be in a DIR forum.

Furthermore, are you claiming that you just completed a rebreather expedition with DIR divers wearing computers?

I doubt it very much.

Your right they dont need a tek computer nor do I dive DIR. DIR does not condone sidemount exploration, thus I would not want to dive DIR.

And I'm not going to get into the DIR argument with anyone here on this forum. Just because you think your diving DIR does not make anyone a better diver than those who do not. I have dove with all the DIR top dogs and know all of them personally.

Yes, I own an RB80 the only so called DIR rebreather. Of course I had to reconfigure all the hoses and gas blocks so I could use it in the caves we explore. It was far from being a DIR configuration.

Dont fall into the brain washed DIR drones, keep your mind open there are much better ways of doing things out there.

 

[JPBECK]

Are you the real Curt? Wow cool -- Dont let these Trolls flair you up! They see your name and attack without knowing what you have done for the industary. I dont dive side mount cause I dont have the need. But you can bet if I did I would be buying a new rig, I would feel weird--- as if I was betraying my old BP & harness, I would tell her it is only temp.

Anyways thanks for everything--

Have a good one!
Later~

 

[cnidae]

there are much better ways of doing things out there.

If you could point them out it would be appreciated. I researched everything for a couple years before I chose to dive this way and this is were I ended up.

 

[Curt Bowen]

If you could point them out it would be appreciated. I researched everything for a couple years before I chose to dive this way and this is were I ended up.

It would all depend on what type and where your diving.

Everyone on our exploration teams dive sidemount, a much better method for remote exploration than back mount. And because I require sidemount only.

Why

1. doubles weight too much and are impossible to carry long distances and through small dry cave passage.

2. singles are available in almost every country

3. Sidemount is safer for solo diving because you can reach, remove and fix problems alone.

4. Our sidemount system is designed to be extremely streamlined with very few snags

5. Doubles are very difficult to raise and lower with ropes because of snag problems with tree roots, overhangs etc...

Our whole exploration system is designed around maximum streamline and simplicity but for remote world locations.

Remember this is just for exploration diving and not the simple back up to the boat or Ginnie Springs type diving.

Back mounts are great for that type of diving and also wreck diving from a boat and I would say DIR configurations are the best because of streamline and simplicity.

I just dont understand those with a DRONE DIR mantality who hammer those who do not dive DIR. Most of these DIR divers I have found have never laid virgin cave line or even explored a virgin shipwreck. DIR fundamentals are a start, but life experince far exceeds any knowledge learned from an instructor or a book.

My moto is don't read the book, write it.