DIR answer to Diving a single steel cylinder in a wetsuit

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Grazie,
Serrada said:- "in a cave a diver doesn’t have to worry as much being slightly overweight because the cave has a bottom. "

He's talking about 'slightly overweight' in a cave with a bottom. He's not advocating that buoyancy control does not matter in a cave - I hardly think that qualifies him as a troll.
 
BTW FWIW by the time you get to do overhead training superb buoyancy is necessary which implies in my mind at least that you have very good sense of how you should be weighted so I'm not defending his statement - I just don't think lambasting him for that one specific comment is the right thing to do.
 
I can't even imagine the look on Danny's face, if I suggested it was okay to be improperly weighted because I could use the bottom to stop myself. Somehow, I think that might be the end of my cave class . . .
 
I'm pretty sure Danny Riordan would think of a practical way to demonstrate the point rather than allow someone to go name calling.
 
dbulmer:
Grazie,
Serrada said:- "in a cave a diver doesn’t have to worry as much being slightly overweight because the cave has a bottom. "

He's talking about 'slightly overweight' in a cave with a bottom. He's not advocating that buoyancy control does not matter in a cave - I hardly think that qualifies him as a troll.
You are propably right, it was a bit OTT...sorry...
It just seems that if you post "the truth" when even a bit of critical thought tells you that it doesen´t make sense (disregarding the fact that you´d need an "uw rockclimbing specialty" to get out of a lot of the popular caves without bouyancy)...
anyways...sorry...
 
Steve R:
I think the DIR section needs a filter change soon.

This type of thread is becoming too common here and it's getting so I can't tell the difference between here and there.

I'm gonna give you a quarter back serrada, so if you leave now you're twenty-three cents ahead of the game. :wink:

Oh, and nice transmitter.

I didn't look at the profile, when did those become standard? Man, I really am behind the time... :wink:

Seriously, I think the DIR section should become 'opt in' if it is to remain useful.
 
In my fundies class one of the instructors dove with steel doubles and a bathing suit. Yup.. no wetsuit, no drysuit. His response to my skepticism was "Well, in this place I could walk out if I had a problem".

You can't be a good diver without being a thinking diver... much less DIR. I'm not saying that there are people here who don't think. I'm just saying that the "no steel unless dry" rule has exceptions. It's obvious that a cave diver would be out of his mind to be both overweighted and on a single tank. But there are situations where being overweighted won't really matter. It's not the ideal solution. It's certainly not standardized. But if its a choice of not diving or of diving a site where you can literally climb out that extra weight, its no big deal. And if it's a choice between sitting on the bottom and drowning or using my surface marker to give me an extra #50 of lift, I'll use the DSMB. My doubles wing only has #40 of lift anyway.

I'm not advocating these methods or labeling them DIR. But all divers need to think about what could happen and what their responses will be taking into account the environment and the tools available.

edit: I'm not saying its ok to dive in caves this way.
 
Forgive my ignorance (I´m not DIR) but isn´t the whole point of DIR that you always strive to DIR. If DIR-divers feel it´s "ok" to "take of their DIR-hat" and "monkeydive" then what separates DIR-divers from the rest of the diving-community? That they don´t use BWOD "when they´re wearing their DIR-hat"?

I´m not picking on Vayu, I see his point, but is there a point where you spend so much time "monkeydiving" that it feels disingenious to call yourself a "DIR-diver"? where would you like to draw the line? Just curious...and sorry if this is a hi-jack...
 
Guys the whole point of my post was because a member (somewhereinla) posted the thread, “Diving with a steel tank and a wetsuit??? A dangerous idea?” on the DIR forum. It probably should have been posted on the general technical forum because it was a general question about technical diving. Not that I’m an authority but I did not see a good DIR answer on somewhereinla’s thread.

Maybe because I don’t post here regularly I have been accused of being a troll and advise that I should be filtered out. I may not have the knowledge of many of you guys but I think taking the funndies class and reading the course material “Doing it Right: The Fundamentals of Better Diving” and watching the DIR/2004 video over and over again I’ve gained a little knowledge about DIR.

Additionally, I have direct knowledge of the subject from my instructor on the subject because most of my diving here in S. FL is done without a dry suit in a wet suit and I use air very quickly being 6’-4” 240lbs. I dive single steel 100 HP’s and have a balanced rig at the beginning of the dive and end.

Furthermore, two direct quotes from “Doing it Right: The Fundamentals of Better Diving” are 1) “ while in a cave, the loss of buoyancy is not as risky because there is usually a bottom” (p.91) how about that my memory serves me well 2) “steel tanks are commonly used with in cave diving with a dry suite, because they must be negative enough to allow the diver to stay down in a low on gas emergency”(p.94). These points were also taught in my DIR-F class and in the videos.

Lastly, I like a quote from (Cave Diver) about a small few DIR guys being out spoken from:

http://www.scubaboard.com/showthread.php?t=44823

“Unfortunately, those few outspoken individuals foster a self-righteous, holier than thou attitude which tends to turn people away from a sound concept.”

And yes the transmitter in my picture is about if not the worst scuba equipment purchase I’ve made, absolutely not DIR. I did post it there though to help another member.
 
but is there a point where you spend so much time "monkeydiving" that it feels disingenious to call yourself a "DIR-diver"? where would you like to draw the line? Just curious...and sorry if this is a hi-jack...

You are right grazie42. The thing is almost all people who call themselves DIR are "monkey divers" anyway. GUE instructors diving with no suits, JJ uses computers... I even hear you can get trimix at the DIR headquarters with no training. I don't call myself DIR anymore because of all the "monkey diving" going on. When it comes down to it though there is no line to be drawn because its just a label and we are all just divers.

The steel tank with a wetsuit debate is more about dive safety while overweighted and ways to fix the problem or get around it if it's the only option available. It's not really a DIR or not debate even though it's in the forum. The reason is because seldom are DIR divers even DIR and if there is one exception to the rule there are millions so we should all be focused on smart diving and not labeling.
 
https://www.shearwater.com/products/perdix-ai/
http://cavediveflorida.com/Rum_House.htm

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