closed valve in the bail out bottle

[do it easy]

Cool, he did say: "I met a person that advised me to have the valve closed during the dive but pressurized. This is to avoid a free flow and loosing gas without knowing it. What do you think?"


I learned that one the hard way once. Really, really bad.

There are alternatives to pony bottles that provide redundancy... I thought you learned the hard way twice?

 

[cool_hardware52]

This is to avoid a free flow and loosing gas without knowing it. What do you think?"[/I]

I think he's right. Sorry, I thought the benefits of keeping the valve closed were obvious.

Closed = no chance of free flow, but water gets in the reg.

Open = no water intrusion into the reg, but it might free flow.

Closed after charging (and periodically recharged) = best of both.

I learned that one the hard way once. Really, really bad.

IMO pony's can create more problems than they solve, and potentially encourage greater risk taking.

Tobin

 

[H2Andy]

imho, pony's are a way of asking for every sort of problem other than the one sought to be solved by the pony

 

[String]

I think they're a great tool and perfect for redundancy on shallow (<30m) no stop dives.

 

[DandyDon]

I was comparing his statement: ...have the valve closed during the dive but pressurized. This is to avoid a free flow and loosing gas without knowing it, to yours as essentially the same thing...

You want to charge the reg with pressure before you enter the water, i.e. turn on, then off. During the dive you should periodically repressurize the reg, again on, then off.

But this approach appeals to me more...

But if you dive with it slung on you at all times I dont think there is anything wrong with keeping the valve on

I don't like the approach of During the dive you should periodically repressurize the reg, again on, then off.

There are alternatives to pony bottles that provide redundancy... I thought you learned the hard way twice?

Nope, once. I have always carried it for a bailout bottle only, but the one time I needed it failed as I had not seen the leak on the first stage behind me nor the drop on the Spg. Since then, it has been on my side, valve easy to see and reach, spg very easy to see. I have used it a few times to bail out others, and once to search a spring for a missing buddy who had sneaked back to his car. I can provide links to those fiasco threads if anyone would like to learn from my mistakes; trolls will be ignored.

imho, pony's are a way of asking for every sort of problem other than the one sought to be solved by the pony

That's been debated for days many times on SB, threads easily found. Just not the focus of this thread.

thanks

 

[String]

I don't like the approach of During the dive you should periodically repressurize the reg, again on, then off.

Its what i do and for me at least good practice to be in. I carry rich mix gases turned off but check to repressurise throughout the dive, i carry my pony in an identical way. Means i dont get into one habit for the pony and a different one with the same tank used as a stage.

Obviously with a rich mix its to stop me accidentally breathing it below its MOD but i dont see the issue if you use it as a pony doing either way, On is fine provided you (i) have an spg and (ii) can see the bottle. However ive found my reg bubbles slightly. It doesnt lose much but loses some.

So for me its turned off and every now and again i valve on/off to make sure the system stays properly pressurised. It takes less than a second to turn the thing on to use if needed.

So in short, for bailout only purposes then side mount do either. Back mount, it has to be left on but has to have an spg that can be read as it could leak.

 

[cool_hardware52]

Don,

I sorry but I'm not sure what you are comparing to what, I'm not trying to be argumentative, I'm just lost.

IMO having a slung bottle on all the time increases the risk of inadvertant lost gas. That's why I choose to keep mine charged, but closed.

I should also say that using a slung bottle in that manner is in the context of a long hose and bungeed backup. An OOG diver will always get what is my mouth. Therefore I need not worry too much if any other bottle I might carry is instantly ready to be offered to a OOG diver.

If I'm breathing from the slung bottle, then of course the valve is open, but here too the OOG diver gets the reg in my mouth, i.e. a known good functioning regulator.

As the donating diver I have plenty of time to find other gas, the OOG diver maybe seconds from inhaling water.

Tobin

 

[DandyDon]

Don,

I sorry but I'm not sure what you are comparing to what, I'm not trying to be argumentative, I'm just lost.

No arguement, just discussing. It looked like you had posted to disagree with Icarusflies above, when you had both said to have it chargedm but you two were in agreement.

IMO having a slung bottle on all the time increases the risk of inadvertant lost gas. That's why I choose to keep mine charged, but closed.

It certainly can, and your approach will prevent that. I just like mine on and watched.

I should also say that using a slung bottle in that manner is in the context of a long hose and bungeed backup. An OOG diver will always get what is my mouth. Therefore I need not worry too much if any other bottle I might carry is instantly ready to be offered to a OOG diver.

If I'm breathing from the slung bottle, then of course the valve is open, but here too the OOG diver gets the reg in my mouth, i.e. a known good functioning regulator.

As the donating diver I have plenty of time to find other gas, the OOG diver maybe seconds from inhaling water.

Tobin

There is where we disagree. Of the OOA divers I have bailed out, no one grabbed my mouth reg. I know that this is taught, but discussions and polls here on SB do not support this.

In my personal case, I advise my buddies and team that my yellow reg and pony reg will be ready to go - just grab it. Do not try to grab the Manta out of my mouth, as it not leaving my mouth. In fact, they might get it out, but I want them to think they cannot, and go for the others. Don't want to lose my dentures in their panicked grab, either.

For anyone who does not know what my Manta is: http://www.manta-bite.com/

The wings bend back to be inserted between the gums and the cheeks for a more secure hold....

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