Cave Diving Fact Find

[LastMate]

Lastmate - be sure you go get yourself killed in some hole that nobody knows about so that your thoughtless death doesn't shut the fun down for the rest of us... mmmk? You kacking in a cave can effect everyone else, so quit bitching about insults.

By the way, Vortex's cave has claimed far too many lives... and up to the gate, its ugly, worn smooth, damaged, and incredibly unattractive. Not even worth checking out without going past the gate, with the key, and training!

Daedalus - hillarious!

apperently you never dove vortex seeing how you have no idea what your talking about with the view of the cave. And for the rest lets see no one has died in Vortex since the 70's and the one man that died recently had a heartattack at the entrance of the cave. nothing related to cave diving, or diving period. so once again it looks like someone else needs to get there facts straight instead of jumping to conclusions

 

[SuPrBuGmAn]

apperently you never dove vortex seeing how you have no idea what your talking about with the view of the cave. And for the rest lets see no one has died in Vortex since the 70's and the one man that died recently had a heartattack at the entrance of the cave. nothing related to cave diving, or diving period. so once again it looks like someone else needs to get there facts straight instead of jumping to conclusions

LOL

Wrong. I've been there, as an OW diver(in OW), as a cavern diver(not diving beyond daylight), as an Intro Diver, an Apprentice Cave Diver, and as a Full Cave Diver, diving beyond the gate with access to the key with full certifications necessary.

Wrong. Atleast a couple OW instructors kacked in the '80s. I believe there was a death there in '03. I also believe there was either a death, or damned near a death just this past year.

Don't know anything about your heart attack guy, unless you are speaking of the guy who died at the entrance to Jackson Blue a bit down the interstate somewhat recently. For the sake of arguement... Wrong.

Stick to your motorbike, I'm sure you're far more appreciated in that kinda circle...

 

[TSandM]

It is sometimes very difficult to remain polite, when people are advocating incredibly stupid and dangerous things. It is particularly difficult to remain polite in the face of a double fatality just a couple of days ago, in which lack of training almost certainly played a part.

I love caves. I'm going cave diving next week. BUT I PUT THE TIME IN AND GOT THE TRAINING, and I understand what the risks are, and I practice diligently to remain as sharp as I can on my skills.

No one should be permitted to recommend cave diving without appropriate training, and I don't blame anybody here for using harsh or even insulting language in the process.

 

[LastMate]

Well if you want to get your feet wet on cave diving check out Vortex springs here in good old florida they have one of the most user friendly caves that ive seen. Now keep in mind with any diving stay within your comfert zone. How ever if your crazy like I am its a great cave to dive with little to no training. Ive logged at least 10 or so dives there and half way into the cave theres lighting installed all the way down to the bottom at 111 feet where it stops at a gate. You can go past the gate provideing proof of proper training at the dive shop they will give you a key but 111 ft in a underwater cave with no training is good enough for me. Like I said im a little crazy so dive within your limits. Check it out vortexsprings.com

Thank you at least someone who knows how to treat someone with proper respect. And yes You ARE right training is a MUST!!! And like I said above Im a little crazy by doing things I may not be trained on but having the Fully trained divers by my side and getting my feet wet for the first time in cave diving was truly spectaculer experance. Above is what I had said orginally that started this whole fight. I never encourge anyone to dive beyond there limits. My limits are beyond my current training but thats me and that is what drives me to further my training and continue to advance in diving. I never buy a car with out test driving it. My OW instructor took me down on a 80 ft down without out ANY training just the basics. I was hook after the first breath I took underwater. SCUBA is a amazing sport that should not be taken lightly due to its dangers. But dont avoide advancement due to fear of getting killed. Personally the 3 shark encounters I have had would make some people sell there gear and never dive again. Was it my fault? NOPE I was in there area And theres no training on how to keep from getting eaten by a shark. But still that doesnt keep me from diving, thats part of the risk you take when you hit that water. My final words to all are YES training is a MUST but dont limit yourself to OW when there is so much more out there to see. Get trained and get wet!! eace2:

 

[deepdiver4]

this dude is a

 

[CuriousRambler]

Those nasty cave sharks are why I'm afraid to get my feet wet, too...

I'll be the first to admit I'm miles from being found in a cave, but I'm curious about the answers to several of the OP's questions, which unless I'm mistaken, were all relevant to obtaining the proper training, skill, and equipment required to safely and responsibly get into cave diving.

You must be the only person who's ever tried anything risky without formal training. I don't have scars down the left side of my body from wrecking a streetbike, I've never dislocated or broken any bones attempting stunts beyond my skill level on a snowboard, and I've never done anything underwater that might be frowned upon by others.

I guess the difference is I don't advocate putting oneself at risk for the experience and use my own immature stunts as reason why others should put themselves in unnecessarily risky situations. Situations that could have effect on entire groups of people, rather than just the person who decided today he might pull off that 70mph 6 mile wheelie on the freeway.

Daedalus - thank you!!

 

[Cave Diver]

Thank you at least someone who knows how to treat someone with proper respect. And yes You ARE right training is a MUST!!! And like I said above Im a little crazy by doing things I may not be trained on but having the Fully trained divers by my side and getting my feet wet for the first time in cave diving was truly spectaculer experance. Above is what I had said orginally that started this whole fight. I never encourge anyone to dive beyond there limits. My limits are beyond my current training but thats me and that is what drives me to further my training and continue to advance in diving. I never buy a car with out test driving it. My OW instructor took me down on a 80 ft down without out ANY training just the basics. I was hook after the first breath I took underwater. SCUBA is a amazing sport that should not be taken lightly due to its dangers. But dont avoide advancement due to fear of getting killed. Personally the 3 shark encounters I have had would make some people sell there gear and never dive again. Was it my fault? NOPE I was in there area And theres no training on how to keep from getting eaten by a shark. But still that doesnt keep me from diving, thats part of the risk you take when you hit that water. My final words to all are YES training is a MUST but dont limit yourself to OW when there is so much more out there to see. Get trained and get wet!! eace2:

I readily admit that I've done numerous dives beyond my training, including several involving overhead environment (cavern, wreck and deco).

At the time I had no idea how totally stupid and dangerous that my actions were.

The bad thing about this type of rationalization, is that you don't know what you don't know.

Diving with someone else that has appropriate training and experience is a good thing from a mentoring standpoint. Relying on that person to be your "safety net" is not.

One thing you should consider is the worst case scenario. What if you got seperated from that person you were relying on, or if they had some sort of problem themselves?

Would you know what to do in that situation? Odds are against it and statistics seem to agree.

If you're interested in pursuing this type of diving, get the appopriate training and learn what equipment is needed and how to use it so you can maximize the the enjoyment and minimize the risk.

 

[SuPrBuGmAn]

Thank you at least someone who knows how to treat someone with proper respect. And yes You ARE right training is a MUST!!! And like I said above Im a little crazy by doing things I may not be trained on but having the Fully trained divers by my side and getting my feet wet for the first time in cave diving was truly spectaculer experance. Above is what I had said orginally that started this whole fight. I never encourge anyone to dive beyond there limits. My limits are beyond my current training but thats me and that is what drives me to further my training and continue to advance in diving. I never buy a car with out test driving it. My OW instructor took me down on a 80 ft down without out ANY training just the basics. I was hook after the first breath I took underwater. SCUBA is a amazing sport that should not be taken lightly due to its dangers. But dont avoide advancement due to fear of getting killed. Personally the 3 shark encounters I have had would make some people sell there gear and never dive again. Was it my fault? NOPE I was in there area And theres no training on how to keep from getting eaten by a shark. But still that doesnt keep me from diving, thats part of the risk you take when you hit that water. My final words to all are YES training is a MUST but dont limit yourself to OW when there is so much more out there to see. Get trained and get wet!! eace2:

There's no reason to be a afraid of most sharks(especially the ones you likely encountered in the Gulf), that fear is just an illusion in the heads of several uninformed people.

There IS a reason to be afraid of caves when you aren't trained to be in them. It doesn't matter if you head in with a Cave Diver. You aren't trained, what happens if THEY get seperated? YOU are screwed. Then some other divers get to risk their well being to fish YOU out. Then there's a strong possibility that a site can be closed to US, because your dumbass kacked yourself for being a reckless douche.

The Diving world JUST lost two good men, one without any cave training(seem familiar?) and another with very minimal training in overheads. Both are dead. Both likely took things far more maturely and seriously than you are...

You don't know your limits! You don't even know that you don't know your limits! Stay out of the caves! I don't care if you kack yourself, I care that you might kack yourself in a location that effects where I can dive.

 

[SuPrBuGmAn]

You must be the only person who's ever tried anything risky without formal training. I don't have scars down the left side of my body from wrecking a streetbike, I've never dislocated or broken any bones attempting stunts beyond my skill level on a snowboard, and I've never done anything underwater that might be frowned upon by others.

I guess the difference is I don't advocate putting oneself at risk for the experience and use my own immature stunts as reason why others should put themselves in unnecessarily risky situations. Situations that could have effect on entire groups of people, rather than just the person who decided today he might pull off that 70mph 6 mile wheelie on the freeway.

Daedalus - thank you!!

One of the biggest issues is that in the beginning of modern cave diving, we've had several people go blindly into the caves. Some died, some didn't. Those who lived, learned to do it better, safer, and developed todays equipment so that todays cave divers don't have to do so blindly, without training, without the proper equipment, without being prepared.

Why go in unprepared now? All the resources are at your fingertips to do things correctly.

 

[Brewone0to]

I guess this would be a bad time to suggest that he might be able to find the answer he needs at that "other" website.
Whats the name of it, I can't remember right now.
Oh yeah, it's that one Larry got all excited about the other day.
Something stop I think.
Maybe deco was in it's name too.