Cave diver dies in South-East (Australia)

[TSandM]

There are a lot of things that are appealing about caves -- clear water, beautiful formations, fossils -- but for someone like Agnes, I think the ultimate appeal is that you have an opportunity to go where no one, no one at all has ever been before. There are not many places in earth about which you can say that, and it's a very powerful lure for some folks.

 

[spectrum]

Its not relevant to this discussion, it just aids to discredit a very good explorer. It is taught to mark unmarked navigation decisions. I do it and everybody I know does it but that didn't lead to this death. Did she miscalculate, yes, but that's irrelevant now. She did the dives that 99% would not do.

I don't know where you're coming from Kevin. I asked a question to help me understand the process. Re-reading my post that's still how I read it. TS&M clarified it for me.

 

[DiverLaura]

I might not remember the wording correct. Might just be the smaller restrictions were that size. That's too small for my comfort level it it goes any distance but 12in tall isn't that bad. Yeah I probably don't recall word for word now. I will look Monday when back on work puter.

I could be wrong, a lot of misinformation has been tossed around, but I believe that the only numbers I saw were posted on her FB page (300 x 600) they were promptly corrected to 600 x 1200 (or 1300) as the guy was exhausted when he posted.

 

[tddfleming]

I had just read an article by Agnes from Underwater Speleology from the July-Sept. 2010 edition. I just had one question about this article, on page 16, for those of you who have it. It reads. "in the end I got banned from the CDA of Australia. Yes, probably the only person to be banned on two continents." Is she also referring to the one in the US?? I understand what lead to the banning in Australia from what she had put in the article, but what did she do to be banned from the other??

I am not trying to make her look bad or discredit her, this is just a general question regarding being banned from an orgainzation and how is happens.

 

[netmage]

"in the end I got banned from the CDA of Australia. Yes, probably the only person to be banned on two continents." Is she also referring to the one in the US?? I understand what lead to the banning in Australia from what she had put in the article, but what did she do to be banned from the other??

Likely referring to an incident @ Ginnie Springs where Ag was informed she was no longer welcome. Something to do w/ a DPV dive way in the back and being overdue.

 

[Tegg]

The articles I read state she had laid a "few metres of line" and that has been removed. I don't recall reading anything that states she was on the line she laid. I don't think it can be determined from the evidence that is there whether she knew where she was or not, but the fact that she passed several Ts without marking them is a big red flag to me. The delay that could have been caused by not having definitive identification of the correct exit could have contributed to not. As with any other incident, we'll likely never know what really happened to contribute to her death.

What was not clear is whether those Ts were already permanently marked with arrows already.

There are many systems where there are permanent markers at intersections. I am sure she is not the first to simply "verify" the markers are correct and continue down the line without laying yet another marker which states what is already clear to any diver.

Either way, as has been stated before, this issue does not look like it was a contributing factor in this death and is adding clutter to the real contributing factors, such as gas management choices. (dropping the only redundant gas supply she had and as such reducing her gas supply in half to continue an exploratory dive)

 

[ScubaNurse758]

Alright, I've been waiting for someone to answer this for me before I asked it but I'll go ahead.... Being that Ag ran out of air at a restriction she couldnt get back through, would the tank that she dropped have made a difference one way or the other in her making it back out alive? Did it look like a situation she could have worked out had she had more time, or was the restriction just too tight for her to make it back through? Any thoughts by the cavers would be appreciated.

Jordan.

 

[DandyDon]

Alright, I've been waiting for someone to answer this for me before I asked it but I'll go ahead.... Being that Ag ran out of air at a restriction she couldnt get back through, would the tank that she dropped have made a difference one way or the other in her making it back out alive? Did it look like a situation she could have worked out had she had more time, or was the restriction just too tight for her to make it back through? Any thoughts by the cavers would be appreciated.

Jordan.

I don't think I have posted in this thread yet, just been reading and understanding what I could - certainly nothing for me to add or address before. I've been watching for lessons I might adopt even tho the diving was well beyond anything I would ever try, but mostly it's just hammered home a general need for caution. Like back the time of his loss, I mentioned to some friends that "If Wes Skiles can die solo diving, then let that be a warning to us all" - and if Agnes can dive pushing the edge in a cave, maybe we should think twice before pushing our respective envelopes.

I don't know the direct answer to your question. My personal answers for me...

When I incur a problem below, I have the rest of my life to resolve it;

The amount of air I carried will have a lot to do with how much of a solution I can explore; and

Even in Cozumel vacation diving, my basic plan is to return to the boat with 35 cf never touched unless needed. 19 cf of that is a pony that some have chided me about, as if they knew more about me than I, but you can never carry too much extra air.​

Make of that whatever you will. I shudder sometimes as the remoteness some will dive at depth in vacation locations, with their single regs & tanks.

 

[TSandM]

More time is always better. She got through going in, so it was POSSIBLE to get through going out, but if she was, as I suspect, in zero viz, she had no visual information to help her orient herself or position her body or her equipment best to pass the tight spot. If she'd had all the gas in the world, would she have managed it? None of knows or will ever know (since they had to chip her out, thus changing the cave) the answer.

 

[Cave Diver]

Alright, I've been waiting for someone to answer this for me before I asked it but I'll go ahead.... Being that Ag ran out of air at a restriction she couldnt get back through, would the tank that she dropped have made a difference one way or the other in her making it back out alive?

It was reported elsewhere that the second tank had sufficient gas for her to exit if she had gotten to where she left it. I don't know that anyone can answer the question of whether she would have been able to make it out if that tank had been with her, because there is no way to know if she needed one more minute to figure things out, or one more hour.