Casino Point - Avalon, Diver Death 9/5/11

[babygirlbowtie]

I completly understand.. the reason I originally sought out this forum was to gain insight into what might have gone wrong.. I have. Lessons I have learned for the day I dive.. 1. Being OW certified does not mean you have the experience required to handle situations in the water, take it slow and stay with the experienced until your really comfortable in the diving environment. 2. Be certain yuou keep track of how much air you have left and surface before you even think you might be short. 3. Try not to pannick stay calm in emergency situations, weights can be dropped as well as gear to make it to the surface (although I believe the other diver was also running out of air). 4. Take a rescue diving class, it could save a life. ps.. I do wonder why they were outside the confines of the park... drifting maybe..?? I know I drift when I snorkle.. Do some use air more rapidly than others.. because of size and perhapes fitness levels as well as exertion???

 

[Blue Sparkle]

babygirlbowtie,

As someone who was in your position not that long ago (i.e. an avid snorkeler thinking about diving), I'm glad you're here asking questions and learning, although obviously the immediate reason is not a good one.

I don't want to derail the thread, but one quick note (that is not necessarily emphasized in all OW classes): In addition to frequent air checking (which is basically all I was taught about air), it is important to plan your gas (air) in advance of the dive. It's the difference between watching the gas gauge in your car go down as you drive across a desert, vs. figuring out the distance and your car's mileage in advance. Of course checking is also a very good habit!

A couple of members here have written really good articles on this topic. I'll link them here since it seems that this incident involved an OOA scenario. Not that you need to completely digest these (or even read them) now; but just to show you what is available when the time comes.

From lamont:
Rock Bottom and Gas Management for Recreational Divers | Spherical Chicken

From NWGrateful Diver:
NWGratefulDiver.com

And you are correct in that not all divers use air at the same rate. Beginners and people in trouble often use more. And anyone uses more deeper than they do shallower. (Although women are oftentimes naturally less "Hooverish" with air due to their physiology.)

Blue Sparkle

 

[DandyDon]

I completly understand.. the reason I originally sought out this forum was to gain insight into what might have gone wrong.. I have. Lessons I have learned for the day I dive.. 1. Being OW certified does not mean you have the experience required to handle situations in the water, take it slow and stay with the experienced until your really comfortable in the diving environment. 2. Be certain yuou keep track of how much air you have left and surface before you even think you might be short. 3. Try not to pannick stay calm in emergency situations, weights can be dropped as well as gear to make it to the surface (although I believe the other diver was also running out of air). 4. Take a rescue diving class, it could save a life. ps.. I do wonder why they were outside the confines of the park... drifting maybe..?? I know I drift when I snorkle.. Do some use air more rapidly than others.. because of size and perhapes fitness levels as well as exertion???

Sadly, a significant number of lost divers are found with weights still on. Either they fail to think of ditching or they run into trouble. My home bud and I drill on that on or just before the first dive of every trip with eyes closed, then each others. Weight systems vary greatly and too often a rescuer can't drop them off of the distressed.

I used to snorkel and free dive before scuba, no training at all, not aware of the risks of shallow water blackout. I hope you know about that, as well as how to get out of riptide. When you get into scuba, your OW class will give you a license to learn - but don't be shy about hiring private DMs for your first ocean dives, or anytime it seems like a good idea.

 

[Ken Kurtis]

At this point the fact that another diver was involved was not known to those on-shore, we thought the surfaced diver was the injured party. A minute or so later we heard that a "diver was stuck in the water" . . . At this point pleas of "we need a diver" were heard from the boat.

This is an excellent point that bears further discussion (and maybe even it's own thread).

I have personally been involved in two rescues at the Park where a diver surfaced screaming for help and only when the initial responders got there (myself & Jon Hardy one time, myself alone the other) were we made to understand the problem was with a diver below, not the diver on the surface. In the first case, Jon & I had both responded from the shore. In the second case, I was already in the water near the back buoy lines teaching the snorkeling portion of an OW class. But in both cases, though we responded quickly and reached the screamer quickly, we didn't have tanks and had to call to shore to send scuba gear out. (And before you ask, "Why didn't you take the screaming diver's gear", in the first case, I think they were also out of or low on air. In the second case, I was doing just that when another diver with scuba arrived on-scene.)

The point of all this is that while it's well and good to have someone in just a wetsuit/mask/fins make a beeline for the diver in distress, standard protocols should call for a second diver (or divers) to be heading out with scuba in case there's also a problem below. And it's certainly better to have too many people out there than not enough. Generally, it will be the initial responders who will "control" the flow and if it's getting too crowded, they'll tell the late arrivals to back off and wait.

But I think a lot of times when we see someone responding to a rescue, we tend to think that it's call taken care of, not that more help might be needed. I've gotten calls from both of the initial responders today (both instructors) and they both were amazed and somewhat disappointed that they were the only two to go out and that until they started calling for more assistance, no one else seemed to be moving.

Just a general scenario to tuck away in the back of your mind.

- Ken

 

[troth]

The point of all this is that while it's well and good to have someone in just a wetsuit/mask/fins make a beeline for the diver in distress, standard protocols should call for a second diver (or divers) to be heading out with scuba in case there's also a problem below. And it's certainly better to have too many people out there than not enough. Generally, it will be the initial responders who will "control" the flow and if it's getting too crowded, they'll tell the late arrivals to back off and wait.

But I think a lot of times when we see someone responding to a rescue, we tend to think that it's call taken care of, not that more help might be needed. I've gotten calls from both of the initial responders today (both instructors) and they both were amazed and somewhat disappointed that they were the only two to go out and that until they started calling for more assistance, no one else seemed to be moving.

Just a general scenario to tuck away in the back of your mind.

- Ken

Ken is exactly correct, when shouting HELP, the natural assumption is the shouter needs the HELP. My initial thought (and my wife's as well) was the person at the surface was injured or in distress. Everyone around me seemed to initially relax when 911 was contacted and help appeared to have been given (or on the way), it felt likes minutes later before the message that "HELP was needed below" came across.

A couple other comments:

1. Although my wife and I are OW, and have been for several years, we realize we are "vacation" divers, and really beginners. We would never consider diving an unfamiliar site without a guide. Perhaps we rely too much on guides, next time we will rehearse our recovery drills.

2. My wife strongly believes, and I agree, a little fear is good. With fear comes respect for danger. Nonchalant attitudes breed complacency, which is never healthy for a beginner.

3. We have recovered from several "incidents". My wife had her regulator knocked out of her mouth at depth by our teen daughter actually. After initial panic and a mouthful of water, she recovered (the good old arm sweep). Another time after surfacing from a night dive (where both my primary and backup light failed), I had my tank become entangled in the boats anchor line at the surface in choppy seas. And YES I panicked at first, then just relaxed and breathed off my tank, EVENTUALLY the boat captain and my buddies wondered where the missing diver was, shone a spot, and found me. The point is saying don't panic is not realistic, everyone panics at some time or another, its being able to calm down and think that is important.

4. The dive park itself breeds a false aura of safety (maybe the word "park" is misleading?) A nice plaque with an underwater map, showing the depths, major points of interest AND the boundaries (highlighted in RED) would be useful. It's scary to think that there are allot of boats, some under power, just outside the buoy line.

 

[stt]

Jade,
I am so sorry.
Myself and my entire family were there and I felt the need to find this posting in order to tell you everything we witnessed. I was the passing boat ( referred to in some of these threads) that was first on the scene as the other diver( your mother's dive buddy) surfaced and yelled for help. She was very upset and obviously distressed catching her breath. We initially thought she needed help herself and my son in law was about to dive in to help her, but as she was able, she told me that another diver was "stuck" down below at 70 feet with no air. I quickly asked her if she still had air in her own tank (hoping she could buddy breathe) and she said no. I asked if the other diver( your mother) could release her belt and tank and come up. She said that no because she was "stuck" ( I dont know on what) and that she needed immediate attention. She just said she was out of air...I immediately called on the radio ( on several channels)stating an "emergency" giving location and details that a diver was down below without air and needed immediate help. The coast guard and avalon harbor responded that help was on the way. Another harbor master boat picked up the buddy diver who then was giving information to the authorites. My family members on my boat were also trying to get the other divers attention that were on shore by waiving lifejackets and yelling for help,and describing a diver below in trouble, and we also called 911. I think most thought the buddy diver was having the problem. We were trying to use every resource. I circled the area to look for any sign that she might be surfacing and then I noticed Two new divers from shore had swam out to us to assist. It was the young man.. and his father I believe. The young man got close and I gave him the approx. location and told him she was "stuck" at 70 feet and without air and unable to release and surface.
HIs father said something to him and he submerged to look for her. I think his name was Brian,or Kevin, but I am not 100% sure. WE all felt helpless. During what seemed like a lifetime of time that passed, I want you to know that myself and my entire family constantly prayed for her in every way. I witnessed something from my family that was truly remarkable and even though she passed I know our prayers were heard. The young man brought her to the surface and yelled for the lifeguard boat which had arrived to help get her on board which they did. We watched as they did everything humanly possible to save her life and as they drove toward the west end for what I knew to be for the decompression chamber if they were to be successful. We stayed at Decanso beach for the rest of the day hoping to hear something but did not until I got home and my daughter found this website.
That young man who went down to help her was the real hero.
My daughter who may be about your age was truly changed by this tradgedy. She may write to you as well. We are a Christian family and we believe God places us in circumstances for a reason. I can assure you that your mother and all of her family including you, and your daughter, were being cared about by God and by complete strangers in her last moments as we held her up in prayer. I assure you that many lives were changed and for a greater wonderful purpose than is revealed at this time. Our hearts are sorrowful today and we join you and your loved ones in your grief. Please know she has truly made a difference to many people with her passing. She will be remembered always. God Bless you and your family.
If you need anything else that I may have not included please let me know here.

 

[DevonDiver]

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[Hatul]

It's amazing how the diver found the victim in view of the vis and large area.

 

[College Diver]

I was there all weekend with a student completing his AOW check-outs. We were at the stairs waiting to go in on our final dive of the trip and the two girls went in ahead of us. We watched them struggle into their fins at the bottom of the stairs and then roll in. As they did I noticed that one did not have her SPG squared away (it was dangling and not on a clip). I was going to say something to the diver but before I could she was caught off guard by a small wave and sorta fell into the water, hesitated for a moment, and then started kicking towards her friend. Both divers were using rented S80s from CDS. My student and I descended the stairs and made our entry and conducted our dive.

Approximately 18 minutes later we were returning on the last leg of our dive and we crossed paths with them around the Cousteau monument, in about 40fsw. I knew it was them because of the gear configuration, the flashlights, and the still dangling SPG. I turned to check the location of my student and when I turned back the two had already passed us, swimming out to deeper water.

12-15 minutes later we surfaced at the steps to see EMS and a large number of onlookers. Upon exiting the water and removing my fins I realized what was going on. It seemed to me by the location of the boats (appx 15-20m outside the boundary) that the incident was unfolding in 80-100fsw. One girl was on the Harbor patrol boat and was noticeably frantic. It also seemed apparent that divers were already in the area and rescue efforts were underway. 5-7 minutes later a diver surfaced behind the rescue vessels (further outside the park), both Harbor Patrol and the Lifeguard vessel were at the divers side helping to bring the injured diver aboard. Shortly thereafter the divers gear was hoisted up on a Harbor Patrol boat.
Chest compressions were begun immediately on the diver and continued for approximately 7-10 minutes on scene, and continued as the vessel made way for Two Harbors.



I cannot emphasize strongly enough that an OW certification DOES NOT make a person a diver: an OW certification is analogous to a Learner's Permit for a driver's license... only after a person has successfully completed a Rescue course would I consider them to be a "Diver" - and then only a "New Diver" - before that they simply don't have the necessary training or dive experience to be of any help to another diver should a situation occur, ergo not a competent dive buddy, ergo NOT a competent diver.

This is truly a sad situation, one which could have been avoided.

As an Instructor I make a point to drill it into my students head that while diving is fun, it is serious - it is an activity which demands a healthy dose of respect and attention to detail. This is a sport which is unforgiving to those with inexperience or who allow themselves to become complacent: much like skydiving, rock-climbing, or any other activity where a person places themselves in an un-natural environment.

My thoughts and prayers go out to the family of the deceased and to the diver whom she was with. It is my hope that for those who are new to the sport, you will remember the lessons which can be drawn from threads in communities such as this, and you will keep these lessons in the forefront of your mind when engaging in this activity. Diving is a fantastic sport - it is real, serious, fun. But above all else it is serious - give to it the presence of mind which it demands.

 

[Ken Kurtis]

Anytime you hear about a diver death, you tend to think "What could have been done differently?" When it's new divers, you also tend to wonder "Was there something that got overlooked or not emphasized enough during training?"

I'll bring up again a study I did some years ago of DAN stats for 2003-2006 that included over 350 fatality reports and - based on my categorization from the casue of death - 70% of the time it was due to diver error. (The rest was 25% medical and 5% bad luck.) If we could somehow magically get divers to stop making bad decisions or to stop failing to make decisions at all - which include all of the areas you mentioned - we could eliminate 70% of the fatalities tomorrow.

For those who read this thread who are involved in teaching people how to dive, over-teaching is certainly preferable to under-teaching. I frequently hear people say, "I was never taught that," or "I wish I'd known that ahead of time." But in 33 years of teaching people how to dive, I've never once had someone come up to me and say, "You know, Ken, you really taught me too much."

- Ken