Breathing off the BC

[blacknet]

Hello,

I suppose if any of you jokers knew how to do research you would discover that YMCA has done studies in this matter they found that you can exhale back into your BC and keep rebreathing the same air 13 times or more without becoming overly hungry for fresh air. They also state bouyancy was affected. This is by far not a simple technique to employ. I believe the K.I.S.S. rule applies here.

If you do this stuff that's fine, by all means do it. I personaly have better things to do with my time underwater.

Ed

 

[Windwalker]

Popeye once bubbled...
Even if it ain't in the NOAA manual? HERESY!

Heresy only exists in institutions that fear change, or cannot stand for free thinkers or new ideas. :mean: I'm all for Heresy!

That dolphin thing may already be a PADI specialty, tho.

Really! Hmm.. I'll have to check into that.. I would Imagine a Liplock over the airhole and a punch in the Gut of the Dolphin would make it give up a little air! :armed:

Then again.. it might drag me down to 400 feet..

 

[The Chairman]

While anything goes when you are in the midst of an OOA, my main point was that you never need to find yourself in that situation. Ever. Training is the key to keeping yourself safe, and the best actions are those that are pro-active. Check your air early and often, stick with your buddy, and end the dive if there is any indication of an equipment malfunction. Go even further and practice the nine steps I outlined earlier.

While we can ascertain with a certain amount of bravado what we will do when faced with no air, very very few have ever been in that crucible. In other words, most of what we think we might try in such a situation can and will be obliterated in the moment of truth. Fight or flight is our immediate reaction when confronted with any danger, and I am certain that most will do the latter. In such a situation, less is more, and the less time we spend fumbling around for an incredibly temporary solution then the "more" quicker we will find our way to the surface. There is lots of air on the surface!

I say this as a diver from the early seventies... before we had SPGs. We usually got our first indication when breathing came just a tad labored and then there was nothing at all. It took but a moment to find our J-valve rod and walla, we probably had a couple of hundred pounds left to breathe. More often than I liked though, the rod was already down and I realised that I had all the air I was going to get. We didn't have BCs back then (only rich guys had them) and so we did what came quite natural. We kicked to the surface... HARD! That could be anywhere from 30 to 100 fsw deep (and no, we didn't always have a depth gauge either). Of course, I wasn't certified back then, so I had no concept of Boyle's law, planning a dive or even staying close enough to a buddy so that I could use his air. I am happy to still be alive. But still, I had no need for any additional air back then... just a strong desire to reach the surface and breathe in that fresh clean air!

Since the advent of the SPG and my formal certification, I have as yet to run out of air. I have found the training from the various agencies on how to avoid an OOA altogether, or how to deal with one if you do screw up to be more than adequate. Of course, I will not stop anyone from using this practice, just as I won't stop anyone from relying on their spare air as a back-up. I just truly believe that the best OOA is one that never ever happens.

 

[Big-t-2538]

Windwalker once bubbled...

Really! Hmm.. I'll have to check into that.. I would Imagine a Liplock over the airhole and a punch in the Gut of the Dolphin would make it give up a little air! :armed:

I think you missed the dolphin thing

 

[Popeye]

blacknet once bubbled...
Hello,

I suppose if any of you jokers knew how to do research you would discover that YMCA has done studies in this matter they found that you can exhale back into your BC and keep rebreathing the same air 13 times or more without becoming overly hungry for fresh air. They also state bouyancy was affected. This is by far not a simple technique to employ. I believe the K.I.S.S. rule applies here.

Finally, the first post with any meat on it from your side of the argument in days.

How about a URL, so the masses can judge this information for themselves?

We've seen your best attempts at non-partisanship.

You say this technique is difficult, please explain why?

It seems to me that the mechanics are about 1/2 as complicated as orally inflating your BC, do you find that unusually difficult to do?

 

[Windwalker]

There is probably a Padi Specialty course!!? <chuckle> Good point, they might be able to teach me how to ask the dolphin for some air. I'll have to check into that! Sure beats being dragged under for angering one of our mammalian friends!

I wonder if PADI also has the course "Mime for Divers"
:ghost:

<pun intended>

 

[Davey Diverson]

NetDoc once bubbled...
While anything goes when you are in the midst of an OOA, my main point was that you never need to find yourself in that situation. Ever.

Then why bother training on ESA procedures at all?

While we can ascertain with a certain amount of bravado what we will do when faced with no air, very very few have ever been in that crucible. In other words, most of what we think we might try in such a situation can and will be obliterated in the moment of truth.

Then why bother training on ESA procedures at all?

In such a situation, less is more, and the less time we spend fumbling around for an incredibly temporary solution then the "more" quicker we will find our way to the surface. There is lots of air on the surface!

But we aren't on the surface. We are submerged, and OOA, where less air is certainly not better than more air. But I digress.

My question had nothing to do with what you might or might not do in an OOA emergency. My question relates to the inevitable.

"At what point during an OOA emergency are you just screwed, and resigned to drowning?"

Lets do a little thought experiment to clarify the question.

You are now dead. You have suffered an OOA and drown. You are drifting along peacfully at depth with an empty tank. Walk yourself backward in time to the point the tank went dry, and write down all the things you did right up to where you inhaled the ocean, and the lights went out.

Edited to remove bad quoting.

 

[The Chairman]

But we aren't on the surface. We are submerged, and OOA, where less air is certainly not better than more air. But I digress.

You answered your own question: the point is to get to the surface with all haste just because you aren't there. There IS more air up there. All you will ever need.

As for your other question:

At what point during an OOA emergency are you just screwed, and resigned to drowning?

Each man must answer this for himself... but possibly its at the point you stopped paying attention to your situation. Hopefully, if that is the case you may get to beat the odds and make a dramatic comeback. Me? I'll just be happy to avoid the "inevietable" and watch my air.

 

[Popeye]

Davey Diverson once bubbled...

Lets do a little thought experiment to clarify the question.

You are now dead. You have suffered an OOA and drown. You are drifting along peacfully at depth with an empty tank. Walk yourself backward in time to the point the tank went dry, and write down all the things you did right up to where you inhaled the ocean, and the lights went out.

Edited to remove bad quoting.

I was fumbling through the NOAA manual, but I couldn't find the index.

 

[Davey Diverson]

NetDoc once bubbled...

Each man must answer this for himself...

Well then go ahead and answer it.

I'll just be happy to avoid the "inevietable" and watch my air. [/B]

Everybody dies of something. That's the inevitable. Now, back to the question at hand. The "you" in this instance isn't the general "you." It's you, specificaly.

At what point during an OOA emergency are you just screwed, and resigned to drowning?