BP/Wings + weight pockets?

[newton]

Here's the deal. My wife and I recently got drysuits, and her old BC does *NOT* fit well at all with the drysuit on. (It was one of the 'special' women's BCs that are small and supposedly comfy. Unfortunately, it's the former, but not the latter).

I recently switched over to a BP/wings (Halcyon 36# setup), and she tried one out a few months ago.

Last night she decided that she needed a new BC so she could dive in her drysuit more comfortably, and remembered that the BP/wings setup wasn't too bad in the water. I temporarily re-rigged my BP, and after trying it on in the common common configurations (skin for pool work, wetsuit for warm water, and drysuit for normal Montana diving), she decided that yes indeed, the BP would be the best solution.

(Female divers take note). So, it looks like we're going to get a new BP/wings for her. However, there is a kicker.

Even with a 6# of weight in the BP, she needs about 18-24# for proper weighting with her drysuit using an Al tank (which is what we have for tanks at this point).

That means she needs to somehow get another 12-18# of weight somewhere on her kit.

The choices I'm aware of are:
1) Halcyon ACB system
2) Weight belt
3) Some other manufacturer's weight pockets.
4) Tank/trim weights
5) Heavier tanks

(1) Doesn't work, because the Halcyon system is too long (each pocket is 9" wide). With her small waist, there is no way to tighten up the belt without it hitting both pockets of the weight system leaving no room for the buckle, even with her drysuit on. (We tried that last night, since I have the Halcyon ACB+ pockets on my setup).

(2) She *hates* (!!!) weight belts with a passion. With her current BC, she is forced to wear a 4# belt since it's weight-integration setup won't take more than 14# of weight, but when she has more than about 10# of weight on her hips, the belt really digs in. The advantage of the BC/BP harness is that the weight is distributed on both the hips and shoulders.

(3) I don't want to have to buy a DiveRite and/or OMS setup just to get weight pockets. Does anyone know of other weight pockets that could be added to a BP harness that are not really 'wide'? (I'd also need a way to mount them to the plate so they don't slide off when putting on the harness).

(4) I threw some trim weights on her Al tank, which enables her to avoid using ankle weights. However, I also need to keep the trim fairly even so she doesn't end up head up or feet up, so any tank/trim solutions needs to be able to spread the weight throughout the entire tank lengthwise. Also, if we go on a dive trip, I need a system that is portable to rental tanks.

(5) We can't afford new tanks *and* a new BC, and the BC is more important. Also, when we go on cold-water dive trips, it may not be feasible to bring the heavier steel tanks with us, so we're going to need a solution for Al tanks.

Does anyone have any other suggestions for adding weight so my wife can be properly weighted?

I did find some ScubaPro S-Tek weight pockets at SimplyScuba, but I couldn't see how wide they were, or if they could be mounted on the belt so they didn't slide off when donning/doffing the harness.

Finally, cheaper is better. I was willing to pay for the Halcyon weight pockets, but that is the absolute limit of what I can afford.

Thanks for any pointers!


Nate

 

[chris_b]

Nate,

Does your Halcyon wing use a Single Tank Adaptor for your Al 80? If not, this would be an option you could add when you get your wife's setup. FredT here on the board makes a heavy STA (I think it's about -5 pounds buoyancy) that could take care of some of the weight.

Chris

 

[Blargh]

hmmmm.... in no particular order.. just thinking out loud so to speak... and assuming a single tank config

- steel backplate, not ali
- steel sta, not ali
- tank trim weight (your call, i hate em, but i dive steel tanks)

- P-weight (lead poured into the backplate groove)
- A-weight (lead poured into the STA)

some combination of the above should let you/her keep a w/belt, (shot, not lumps!!!) with a manageable weight on it, say six to eight pounds.


having said that, there might be a better way... but you should really test it first.

maybe, just maybe, you can buy/beg/borrow/.... a nice warm NON-BULKY undersuit. that would allow her to dive with a less air in the suit to begin with, thus needing less lead.

 

[TexasMike]

Originally posted by newton
(3) I don't want to have to buy a DiveRite and/or OMS setup just to get weight pockets. Does anyone know of other weight pockets that could be added to a BP harness that are not really 'wide'? (I'd also need a way to mount them to the plate so they don't slide off when putting on the harness).

The OMS "No-Sag" weight pockets do not have to be "only" for the OMS system. I have these and it's my opinion that they could be adapted to any BP harness system with a bit of inginuity(sp?).

They have loops on the back that the waist belt slips through, then a bit of their own harness wish clips to the upper d-ring so the shoulder harness supports some of the wieight (therefore the "no-sag" name).

 

[newton]

Originally posted by Blargh
hmmmm.... in no particular order.. just thinking out loud so to speak... and assuming a single tank config

- steel backplate, not ali

I already assume a 6# SS BP.

- steel sta, not ali

Not STA, but that's certainly an option for additional weight. (Although, it's additional $$ as well). The Halcyon setup we'd get doesn't require an STA, but having one wouldn't hurt.

- tank trim weight (your call, i hate em, but i dive steel tanks)

I'm already doing that for 4# right now for her trim. Much more and her trim would be out-of-whack.

- P-weight (lead poured into the backplate groove)
- A-weight (lead poured into the STA)

Neither one of these are optimal since they don't give me ditchable weight. Also, the same BP will be used for warm-water diving at some point, so I don't want her to be massively overweighted when on vacation.

some combination of the above should let you/her keep a w/belt, (shot, not lumps!!!) with a manageable weight on it, say six to eight pounds.

having said that, there might be a better way... but you should really test it first.

maybe, just maybe, you can buy/beg/borrow/.... a nice warm NON-BULKY undersuit. that would allow her to dive with a less air in the suit to begin with, thus needing less lead.

Her undersuit is fairly non-bulky already (300G polartec). She is just a light-weight person, and has always required more weight than I to get down. (I weigh ~200#, she was ~#100).

It seems like this isn't an easy problem to solve. The sad part is the BP/wings really are a better fit for her, but trying to get a weight-integrated solution for the setup is difficult for smaller people.



Nate

 

[newton]

The OMS "No-Sag" weight pockets do not have to be "only" for the OMS system. I have these and it's my opinion that they could be adapted to any BP harness system with a bit of inginuity(sp?).

They have loops on the back that the waist belt slips through, then a bit of their own harness wish clips to the upper d-ring so the shoulder harness supports some of the wieight (therefore the "no-sag" name).

How wide are the pockets themselves? The Halcyon pockets are 9" wide, so when you have one on each side, it adds up to 18", which is how long the strap needs to be to give her a good-snug fit. (This means there's no room for the buckle, or any room when she is using a lighter suit.)


Nate

 

[TexasMike]

The pockets are about 6 inches side to side.

This weekend, I will be diving without my IQ harness (manufacturing glitch requires that it be returned to factory) and in a bp/wing setup much like you're discussing. And I plan on using my pockets as I am describing.

So come Monday, I'll have some more insight for you.

 

[Tavi]

Hi Nate,

I don't know what the Halcyon weight pockets would have cost you.
The DUI Weight and trim system can be had for $99. It's a harness with weight pockets that have a quick release. It can be adjusted for proper trim.
I have a freind that dives with one of these weather he's in a shorty with 6lbs, or in a drysuit with 20lbs. .

Hope this helps

 

[tombiowami]

How about the FredT 9lb bp with 6 lb. STA? That gets it down to a reasonable weight belt, if more is needed. With the drysuit you have the buoancy redundancy. Add a scout or two on the straps and a few trinkets...

For the warm water trips get an alum bp, FredT for $50 or so I think.

The 36lb. wing would work for both.


Tommy

 

[newton]

Using some of the suggestions from the folks on the board, I *think* I have a solution.

It's a bit convoluted, but it should handle all the scenarios.

First, my wife used 6# of weight just to get down with no exposure suit in salt water. (I don't see us diving anywhere in fresh water that doesn't require some sort of protection.)

I'd like to avoid having to buy two BP, one for warm-water diving, and one for cold-water diving.

So, that means having a *really* heavy BP isn't the best solution, since it would mean swapping out the BP whenever we time in warm water. (Not that it's a big deal, but it means more $$).

So, I think the following will work.

Using either the 27# of 36# Halcyon wing.

* Fred T BP (6#)
* Fred T heavy STA (5#)
* Velcro pockets on a tank strap, which we've used to keep her from needing ankle weights. (3#)
* Halcyon trim pockets 2 * 4# (see below)
* If we need more, a very lightweight weight belt.

This gives us 6 + 5 + 3 = 14# of non-ditchable weight
Plus, we now have 8 + weight-belt of ditchable weight.

This allows her to have anywhere from 14 -> 32 pounds, which should be enough.

For warm water, we lose the heavy STA and rely on the built-in STA on the Halcyon wing, and we can lose the weight-belt and tank trim weight, leaving us with 6# of non-ditchable, plus whatever we need in the trim pockets for her exposure suit (3mm neoprene or somesuch).

The use of the heavy STA was the one big help, and after talking with Extreme Exposure this afternoon, we came up with the following 'hack' that just might work.

Halcyon makes some tank/trim pockets that have a fastech-buckle for holding the weight in the pocket. If we mount a couple of these pockets on the BP waist harness with the pockets facing down, we can *hopefully* make it possible to ditch weights from them by simply unfastening the buckle, which would cause the weight to slide out. Since the pockets only hold up to 4# of weight, there shouldn't be *that* much pressure holding them in, or so I'm hoping.

That gives us 'small' integrated weight pockets. It isn't much (8#), but that should be hopefully enough to offset any drysuit flood, or other emergency buoyancy problems.

Plus, it gives us ditchable pockets for diving wet. The only problem I now have is finding the Halcyon wing cheap enough. They want over $300 just for the darn wing, and that's more than my budget can handle.



Nate