Article: Shearwater Announces Nitrox Recreational Mode for Petrel

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It's not a matter of buying it with and without the transmitter. There's a large R&D cost that could be put towards better things than something like AI. Also, the computer would require a transceiver that is currently not in there. All of that adds cost to the unit I'd be purchasing. Yeah, the technology is already there....but Shearwater doesn't have it. That means they'd have to either purchase it from someone or develop it themselves.

True. On the other hand, this could add sales and bring in more profit, likely more than off-setting the added costs. Might even bring in more revenue that could help in developing other features that tech. divers do need.

Richard.
 
So much misinformation going on here.

For open circuit diving where a diver incurs a decompression obligation and is under a ceiling, gas planning is done in such a way as to anticipate the failure/loss of one's breathing gas - this has little or nothing to do with how you measure it (AI/SPG/Rhythm Method).

AI as a "redundancy" is unnecessary because anything that could happen to render your primary means of measuring tank pressure useless would end the dive (and you know you have enough gas to exit the water, because that is a part of your plan).

If you want to dive AI then dive AI. In open water where there is no overhead, I don't see a real issue with it other than it having more o-rings and failure points that you don't really need. In an overhead there's a risk of impact and breakage causing an exposed HP port on the first stage. Again, not the end of the world, you'd just isolate and end the dive.

AI is one of those gimmicky things that divers who stay reasonably shallow and perform dives with low levels of complexity can safely rely on in lieu of really doing in depth dive planning - and that's OK for most vacation dives and most vacation divers.

Having one won't kill you, it also won't give you anything you don't already have. If you buy into the idea that we only take things into the water which we need to complete the dive then you'll likely not bother with it. If you like gadgets, you might. We don't use AI in our dive team because it's philosophically incompatible. if you can build a dive team with a different philosophy, more power to you.

I have six Shearwater computers (2 CCR controllers, 2 FC/PPO2 Monitors, 2 standalone bailout computers) and they have taken me to and from depths up to 137m safely. They're well built and reliable. I don't think they need AI, but if the vacation diver market will bare the price tag of the computer and Shearwater can incorporate it without compromising the functionality they've become so famous for offering then what's the harm?
 
If they did decide to offer it just how much would it add initially to the base cost? Could I still get my base model without the transceiver hardware and software or would I have to spend money on features I do not need or want. And do not want to pay for.

There are enough AI computers out there to choose from. Several I can think of off the top of my head. A few capable of mixed gasses. Yet they have not taken over the market and been widely accepted by the tech community. Due to the cost they are not even taking over the recreational.market. If you want an AI computer buy one of the ones now out. Why even worry about Shearwater making one? Unless it's because of the high quality service and support Shearwater gives that far outpaces anyone else on the market.

People buy them because of what they are. Not because of what they could or should be. If they were to announce they were going to introduce an AI model but it would add $500.00 + to the price for the transmitter and what a hundred or two for added "features" in the comp itself, and it would have all the necessary stuff in the comp to handle it, & eventually all the base models would have it, I'd find a way to afford a couple extra petrels so I would never have to buy one of the new ones.

Sent from my DROID X2 using Tapatalk 2
 
If they did decide to offer it just how much would it add initially to the base cost? Could I still get my base model without the transceiver hardware and software or would I have to spend money on features I do not need or want. And do not want to pay for.

There are enough AI computers out there to choose from. Several I can think of off the top of my head. A few capable of mixed gasses. Yet they have not taken over the market and been widely accepted by the tech community. Due to the cost they are not even taking over the recreational.market. If you want an AI computer buy one of the ones now out. Why even worry about Shearwater making one? Unless it's because of the high quality service and support Shearwater gives that far outpaces anyone else on the market.

People buy them because of what they are. Not because of what they could or should be. If they were to announce they were going to introduce an AI model but it would add $500.00 + to the price for the transmitter and what a hundred or two for added "features" in the comp itself, and it would have all the necessary stuff in the comp to handle it, & eventually all the base models would have it, I'd find a way to afford a couple extra petrels so I would never have to buy one of the new ones.

Sent from my DROID X2 using Tapatalk 2

I'm with you. If Shearwater adjusted the pricing to reflect the addition of features that I don't find value in, and a different product existed which would tick my boxes, I would buy a different product.

Though you're not paying for a product that offers only features you use (at least I'm assuming, since I believe you're an open circuit diver and you've paid for CCR functionality in your current Shearwater machines).
 
Though you're not paying for a product that offers only features you use (at least I'm assuming, since I believe you're an open circuit diver and you've paid for CCR functionality in your current Shearwater machines).

I'm an OC diver that is diving a Petrel. I didn't mind paying for the CC functionality for two reasons: 1) I don't believe it added any cost at all. The software had to be there anyway for the Fischer model, they were nice enough to include it in the stand alone model. Plus, the price is DOWN from the Predator OC and lower than comparable OC-only computers. 2) I didn't choose to buy TRUE CC functionality.....in that I didn't buy a Fischer connector.

Having said that, the Fischer connector is a VERY good example of what I'm afraid of. Can we all assume that the connector that has to get mounted in the Petrel isn't overly expensive? Can we all agree that the majority of the software is already there? Can we all agree that AI receiver capability would add AT LEAST that much more hardware and software? The Fischer is $500 more than the stand alone. If the Petrel cost $1350 and you HAD to get a Fischer instead of the $850 option, I wouldn't have bought a Petrel.
 
Agree. My Predator does not have the fisher connector. But you can bet that it would be used as a back up if I ever did go the black box of death route. Because I would only buy a unit with Shearwater electronics on it. But since unless I hit the lottery there is no way I'd buy a rebreather. Because I would need to be wealthy enough to not have to work in order to dive it enough to justify the cost.
As an aside I always have my eyes open for another Predator. One of these days there is going to be one for sale when my wallet is in the right state. On that day I will snap it up.

Sent from my DROID X2 using Tapatalk 2
 
...2) I didn't choose to buy TRUE CC functionality.....in that I didn't buy a Fischer connector.
...

Let's just back up there a minute. The Fischer connector does NOT add "true CC functionality" to the predator. The software has full CC functionality, whether you have the Fischer or not. What the Fischer connecter DOES add is the ability to plug it into a compatible rebreather and display the PO2 of cells (up to 3) on the Predator screen. In the case of a Predator controller, it can also act as the controller brain for the rebreather head.

BUT - full CC functionality is there in CC mode on a Predator with no Fischer. I know. I have one and I dive a Prism Topaz which is as "real" a CC rebreather as any that exist. And I use the predator in CC mode on every dive as my primary computer.

In fact, a Fischer on a dive computer would be a total waste for me as I'm not about to start drilling holes in my Prism head just to try and add a fourth cell to plug in a Shearwater.
 
You're nitpicking words, although the point is still the same. I didn't choose to buy ADDITIONAL cc funcionality. I didn't choose to buy FULL cc functionality. I didn't choose to purchase a Shearwater with a Fischer connector.
 
You're nitpicking words, although the point is still the same. I didn't choose to buy ADDITIONAL cc funcionality. I didn't choose to buy FULL cc functionality. I didn't choose to purchase a Shearwater with a Fischer connector.

No he's not, he's dead on. The fischer cable gives you the ability to monitor your actual inspired PPO2 rather than a fixed PPO2. The CCR controller version [non fischer cable, hardwired] allows the petrel/predator to adjust the PPO2 via computer and solenoid. The standalone petrel/predator have full CCR capability based on a fixed setpoint.

All Shearwater computers currently being sold have full CCR support. Just like with the potential of an AI module being implemented in the software, there is an R&D cost associated with embedding that functionality in the computer which OC divers are paying for when they purchase a unit.
 
Just like with the potential of an AI module being implemented in the software, there is an R&D cost associated with embedding that functionality in the computer which OC divers are paying for when they purchase a unit.

I see your point, yet I continue to disagree with the SPIRIT of it. Shearwater is a technical computer company (or has been so far). Providing CCR support on some of their computers only makes sense. Merging it with their OC computers (versus introducing another one, specific to CCR) reduces the cost to the CCR guys. Plus, like I said earlier, do you think the Fischer connection costs $500 to add? No. That's where the R&D money is coming from.
 
https://www.shearwater.com/products/swift/

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