Are you a vegetarian?

[Papa_Bear]

BTW, we are not even close to the point were we can't manage our resources! Modern farming and yes animal husbandry gets better all the time! In the US 5% of the population feeds the world! It is only getting better, not worse, as the glass half empty crowed would have it! It has been getting better every generation since modern times! Look at life expectancy! Hard to argue the facts with feelings!

 

[sibermike7]

If you are born of a Hebrew mother you are a Jew, You can't recruit people to be Jewish! I understand conversion, but you have to want to convert, and learn Yiddish and the history! That was my point! You can be Hebrew and not a Jew and I guess you can be a Progressive Jew and eat Bacon? My point was that I have no problem with people eating whatever thy want, but I draw the line when it is stated that their way is of higher morality or superiority! I would no more force someone to eat anything they didn't want to than Riding on the back of a whale to 3000ft!

I like the analogy!

Anyway, yes you CAN convert to the Jewish religion. The Bible is full of examples (well, maybe not FULL, but there are enough) of folks converting to Judaism. Think: the harlot Rahab who is in the lineage of Jesus!! You have to have a Jewish mother to be consider a Jew. There is a distinction between religion and nationality.

You don't find Jews in pairs going door to door recruiting people to convert!

True! But there are other ways to proselytize.
I am not arguing on how active they are just, whether or not they ever proselytize or proselytized anyone! Kind of like the old adage never answer TRUE on a T/F test if the question contains always or never.

Shalom Papabear!


PS. You made my day with the image of 2 Rabbis going door to door with name tags and a black bag!!!
Thanks!

 

[sambolino44]

Was on a dive boat recently and on one day they served fish with the buffet style lunch

I was quite surprised to see this seen as we'd all just been diving with them, however I'm a veggie

This seemed to cause a few different reactions from different people so I was wondering how many veggies are out there that dive?

...See I told you it was a religion! The Earth First, left wing, fringe, nut buckets, and they all want YOU to do as they say! In the name of Morality, The Earth, or the truth that they hate people and want you to see it their way! Words like "Exploit" or "Exploitation of animals" are dead give a ways! They see use as the enemy of the earth and the problem! It is the worst form of elitism and it is encroaching into everyday life! No Rodeos, No Horse Racing, No pet ownership, and its just like this thread! It starts out innocent and smiles and then you get lectured on animals "Rights" as if they had any! When they can defend them they can have them, otherwise they were put on the earth to serve us! Our obligation to them is being good stewards! How come its okay to Spay or Neuter? But cutting of tails and Dewclaws is becoming illegal? It is a slippery slope!

BTW, why is this here and not the PUB? What does it have to do with diving?

Maybe you should stay in the pub. It seems to me that the OP is quite relevant to diving and the diving community, whereas this post of yours... what the heck are you talking about? But since you brought it up, if animals don't have a "right" to good stewardship, then where does our "obligation" to them come from? Now don't get me wrong, I don't believe animals have rights in the same sense of the rights we think about for ourselves. But to assert that the way we are currently managing the world's fisheries is "being good stewards" is absurd. And your argument that "When they can defend them they can have them..." shows that you do not understand the concept of rights. Or maybe you confused having rights with exercising them. Whatever. But rodeos? Man! Dude was only pointing out the irony of eating the animals he had just been admiring, and you come off all paranoid.

 

[DaleC]

If I'm reading the above excerpts correctly, in their mutual context, you have no problem inflicting pain upon, killing, butchering, or cooking animals; you just won't actually put their flesh in your own digestive tract, and this is out of a religious or quasi-religious conviction. If this interpretation of where you draw the line is correct, I'm curious about its basis.

I think you drew the wrong inference. My intention was to say I have done those things in the past. I do not do them now. Having done them in the past however I can't take a "superior" position to others that do so now. The old "let he without sin cast a stone thing". No stones from me I'm afraid.

Sibermike - I enjoy a good back and forth of ideas but the key word is ideas so you're going to have to lay off the hookah man. I can't even make sense out of what you are saying You seem bent on arguing the letter of the law instead of the intent. I didn't make my post for that reason. Read it again - either you get it or you don't. I'm not interested in nit picking.

Sabbath999 - Very much my experience too. Weird eh?

Papa Bear - There is no VEGETARIAN group. We disbanded that in 1952.

 

[BHB ScubaTroll]

Salad
soup
appitizer
main course
... sides...
dessert
The more the merrier...

If some or all contain, flora, fauna, beef, pork, chicken or other... the better. If it fills my gullet it's nurishing

 

[Papa_Bear]

Your entitled to your opinion and your food! There are always exceptions to the rule, but in general most are good stewards! Rights are given from our creator and yes you have to defend them! The Holocaust is a good example, they had rights, but no way to defend themselves! The animals have no right to good stewardship! That is a moral obligation handed to man by god! So if you have no god then you make it up as you go along with moral absolutism! Is it right to serve fish on a dive boat? Dam right it is, just like the Bar-B-Q at the Rodeo! I guess you don't read much? Don't understand the PETA agenda, well I do and have Vegan friends! Remember just because your paranoid doesn't mean someone isn't following you! You're lack of knowledge on the subject doesn't make you're argument any stronger by putting me down!

 

[NudeDiver]

All I know is, meat is tasty.

 

[sambolino44]

BTW, we are not even close to the point were we can't manage our resources! Modern farming and yes animal husbandry gets better all the time! In the US 5% of the population feeds the world! It is only getting better, not worse, as the glass half empty crowed would have it! It has been getting better every generation since modern times! Look at life expectancy! Hard to argue the facts with feelings!

I disagree. The common white fish used to be cod. Then it was pollock. Now it's haddock or something. Maybe I got the order wrong, but the point remains; we keep eating up all the good fish and having to move on to something less desirable. The only way you can call that managing is that we keep managing to find another stock of fish to deplete. But it won't last.

And to your point of modern farming and animal husbandry: the unnecessarily high production levels are the result of genetic monoculture driven by intellectual property rights which are necessary to sustain the oligarchical multinational agribusiness corporations, and soil-depleting intensive farming techniques which are dependent on oil which is running out. Boy, there's enough buzz words in that to turn anybody off. But, whether or not I have what it takes to lay them out before you, I'm confident that there are plenty of facts to back up my feelings.

 

[sambolino44]

Your entitled to your opinion and your food! There are always exceptions to the rule, but in general most are good stewards! Rights are given from our creator and yes you have to defend them! The Holocaust is a good example, they had rights, but no way to defend themselves! The animals have no right to good stewardship! That is a moral obligation handed to man by god! So if you have no god then you make it up as you go along with moral absolutism! Is it right to serve fish on a dive boat? Dam right it is, just like the Bar-B-Q at the Rodeo! I guess you don't read much? Don't understand the PETA agenda, well I do and have Vegan friends! Remember just because your paranoid doesn't mean someone isn't following you! You're lack of knowledge on the subject doesn't make you're argument any stronger by putting me down!

Well, now you lost me! I apologize for putting you down, I do get carried away sometimes. It's getting late and I have to get up early for work tomorrow, so I'll have to pick this up again tomorrow. Don't read much? Lately all I read is diving stuff, so not much help there. I certainly do not support the PETA agenda. I'd like to know what you mean by lack of knowledge on the subject; what subject? I mean, there's so many that I have a lack of knowledge in, it's hard to know which one you're talking about! Anyway, I've enjoyed the exchange, I look forward to more, and I'd really enjoy talking about it in person with you after a day of diving, over a nice steak-and-lobster dinner! (Maybe you missed the part where I said I do eat meat and fish, just not so much!) Cheers!

 

[NudeDiver]

If humans stopped breeding, all the problems in the animal and environmental world we cause would stop in about 100 years.