Any Scuba badges in scouts?

[mmmeenehan]

After thinking about the Scuba MB - I think the biggest hurdle will be cost.
I can't think of any other MB that has such a high cash investment...
Most MB reqs are just visit, discuss, explain, etc... vs actually "doing".
And the doing part of a basic Scuba MB should really just involve the "free"
demo classes.... vs the entire instructor led class & pool time.

My shop (in Northern Virginia) offers Scuba BSA for $25, including use of all required equipment and the pool time. From what I've heard, the merit badge will NOT include the requirement for open water certification (like the Venture Ranger Scuba elective does). It will probably be like the Scuba BSA award with an open water dive. No high cash investment needed.

 

[Mycroft]

and then - why is the Scuba "award" not already the real reqs for a MB ??
it seems pretty comprehensive compared to other MB's

Two things I can think of right off. National wants to keep the number of Merit Badges around 121. So, when you talk about adding a new one, you also have to figure out which one it is replacing.

There ar ea lot of waterfront related merit badges already out there. This is limiting to people in the midwest, for example. They are worried about balance.

A guy in the carolinas makes a dive flag that is scout knot sized. I ordered some, and even sent it to council proposing it as a knot that can be worn by any certified diver of any age. As of right now, it was not allowed.

 

[diver_pirate]

I have taken our scout unit on summer dive trips with Scouts to Florida Sea base, Florida Keys and Bonaire. There is no merit badge. Florida Seabase offers a Scuba certification that includes the open water dives (PADI). You can wear the Seabase High Adventure Patch under the right pocket. But no more. The way things seem to be going with the insurance and lawyers it will probably only be a virtual dive trip shown on an IPOD to get the merit badge if at all.

It is sad to me as the scout age youth of today will probably be the last generation to ever see a living coral reef. What ever we can do to bring this experience to youth will well be worth the effort. I just hope the folks in Texas will see the benifit of this merit badge.
DP

 

[The Chairman]

Great discussion.

I would suggest that we ALL petition BSA to do something "more".

I would love to see a Scuba MB where one of the optional requirements is to earn Open Water from any recognized agency AND they have to participate in a reef clean-up or inventory.

 

[mike_s]

Great discussion.

I would suggest that we ALL petition BSA to do something "more".

I would love to see a Scuba MB where one of the optional requirements is to earn Open Water from any recognized agency AND they have to participate in a reef clean-up or inventory.

I think in general that BSA would prob be against a "Scuba Merit Badge" because you have to have special BSA permits anytime any scouter does anything scuba related (if I'm not mistaken)

Unless the did their own certification, like YMCA did, and I don't think BSA would do that, I can't see the merit badge requirements being anything more than the OW requirements by certain agencies, except maybe doing swim tests and "tell 5 things you can do as a scuba diver to help the environment".

While I think that getting OW certified as a youth is worthy of a merit badge, I just don't see them doing it for liability reasons.

 

[The Chairman]

No, BSA defers to the agencies already for Scuba Diving and actually only currently recognize PADI, SSI and NAUI with deferrals done on a case by case basis at the council level. The ONLY extra requirements for Scuba

From: Guide to Safe Scouting: Aquatics Safety

Scuba Policy

Any person possessing, displaying, or using scuba (self-contained underwater breathing apparatus) in connection with any Scouting-related activity must either be currently certified by, or enrolled in a training course authorized by the National Association of Underwater Instructors (NAUI), the Professional Association of Diving Instructors (PADI), or Scuba Schools International (SSI). These agencies are recognized by the Boy Scouts of America for scuba training and instruction. Alternatively, if PADI, NAUI, or SSI training and instruction is not available, certification may be accepted from other agencies that comply with Recreational Scuba Training Council (RSTC) guidelines, provided that such acceptance has been expressly approved by the BSA local council in consultation with the BSA national Health and Safety Service.

Cub Scouts
Youth members in Cub Scouting are not authorized to use scuba in any activity.

Boy Scouts and Varsity Scouts
The use of scuba is not authorized for a BSA unit, except so that registered Boy Scout youth and leaders may participate in the Scuba BSA program conducted by a certified dive instructor in compliance with this policy. Scuba BSA is not a diver certification program.
Scuba training programs may be a part of troop/team activities for participants who are 14 years of age or older. Members who meet the age requirement and are properly certified may participate in group dives under the supervision of a responsible adult who is currently certified as a dive master, assistant instructor, or any higher rating from NAUI, PADI, or SSI. Student divers must be under the supervision of a currently certified NAUI, PADI, or SSI instructor. No exceptions to the BSA age requirement are permitted. Scouts with a junior diver certification may dive only when accompanied by a buddy who is a certified open-water diver at least 18 years old.

Venturers
Scuba programs may be a part of Venturing activities for participants who are 14 years of age or older. Members who meet the age requirement and are properly certified may participate in group dives under the supervision of a responsible adult who is currently certified as a dive master, assistant instructor, or any higher rating from NAUI, PADI, or SSI. Student divers must be under the supervision of a currently certified NAUI, PADI, or SSI instructor. No exceptions to the BSA age requirement are permitted.

 

[northen diver]

I think in general that BSA would prob be against a "Scuba Merit Badge" because you have to have special BSA permits anytime any scouter does anything scuba related (if I'm not mistaken)

Unless the did their own certification, like YMCA did, and I don't think BSA would do that, I can't see the merit badge requirements being anything more than the OW requirements by certain agencies, except maybe doing swim tests and "tell 5 things you can do as a scuba diver to help the environment".

While I think that getting OW certified as a youth is worthy of a merit badge, I just don't see them doing it for liability reasons.

I take our troop out on diving trips 6-8 times per year. All that is needed is a tour permit, and have a divemaster or higher, taking the O/W certified young men out diving. That is the only reason that I did the divemaster training, so we could go diving as a group.
Now for certifiing the young men as O/W divers, it will obvious always be a certified instructor.

It isnt really a liability issue either. I also take the young men out rock climbing (TR, sport and trad climbing) and whitewater in the New River Gorge (class 5 rapids) which has just as many risks as Scuba. BSA does have merit badges for rock climbing and whitewater rafting which is just as risky as scuba is. I think that the BSA just hasnt gotten around to getting a merit badge together yet for scuba is all.

BTW, all of our scouts are YMCA certified. All you need to do is make sure that the certifiing agency is part of the RSTC and your council will approve it. The local YMCA's and instructors do the BSA for only $150.00 my area.

 

[northen diver]

No, BSA defers to the agencies already for Scuba Diving and actually only currently recognize PADI, SSI and NAUI with deferrals done on a case by case basis at the council level. The ONLY extra requirements for Scuba

From: Guide to Safe Scouting: Aquatics Safety

Pete: As long as the agency is part of the RSTC, the local council shouldnt really have a problem with the agency training or guiding the young men on scuba. All it took for me was a phone call to the local council and a questions of why you dont want to use one of the BSA's recommended recognized agencies.

Just a FYI for anyone wanting to use another agency.

 

[mike_s]

No, BSA defers to the agencies already for Scuba Diving and actually only currently recognize PADI, SSI and NAUI with deferrals done on a case by case basis at the council level. The ONLY extra requirements for Scuba

From: Guide to Safe Scouting: Aquatics Safety


Originally Posted by Guide to Safe Scouting
Scuba Policy

[snip]

Boy Scouts and Varsity Scouts
The use of scuba is not authorized for a BSA unit,. except so that registered Boy Scout youth and leaders may participate in the Scuba BSA program conducted by a certified dive instructor in compliance with this policyScuba BSA is not a diver certification program.

Scuba training programs may be a part of troop/team activities for participants who are 14 years of age or older. Members who meet the age requirement and are properly certified may participate in group dives under the supervision of a responsible adult who is currently certified as a dive master, assistant instructor, or any higher rating from NAUI, PADI, or SSI. Student divers must be under the supervision of a currently certified NAUI, PADI, or SSI instructor. No exceptions to the BSA age requirement are permitted. Scouts with a junior diver certification may dive only when accompanied by a buddy who is a certified open-water diver at least 18 years old.

Venturers
Scuba programs may be a part of Venturing activities for participants who are 14 years of age or older. Members who meet the age requirement and are properly certified may participate in group dives under the supervision of a responsible adult who is currently certified as a dive master, assistant instructor, or any higher rating from NAUI, PADI, or SSI. Student divers must be under the supervision of a currently certified NAUI, PADI, or SSI instructor. No exceptions to the BSA age requirement are permitted.

So from this it looks like that 'Scuba is not authorized for BSA units', unless they are taking a training course. However, then it says that they can participate in group dives with a Dive Master (or above).

But then Venture scouts can participate in group dives (with a divemaster or above).

Is this kinda confusing the way they worded it? Of do they just not want troops doing regular diving but only allowing venture groups to do it? (Which isn't a big problem as you just form a new venture unit for the kids who want to dive in the troop).

I also found the 14 year old age limit interesting since they seem to allow PADI and NAUI which allow people under 14 to get certified (to my knowledge).

 

[The Chairman]

Pete: As long as the agency is part of the RSTC, the local council shouldnt really have a problem with the agency training or guiding the young men on scuba. All it took for me was a phone call to the local council and a questions of why you dont want to use one of the BSA's recommended recognized agencies.

Just a FYI for anyone wanting to use another agency.

That is true: it should be fairly automatic... but it DOES have to be done to stay within the guidelines and to keep the insurance in force.