Agency Wars

[The Kraken]

"Me? I'll be the guy doing a giant stride off the back of the boat while the debate rages!"

RJP, I love it !!!

the K

 

[cflJason]

I have no freakin' idea, but it is really annoying that I can't post anything without somebody looking at my stats and bashing PADI, probably just to be annoying. I have very good friends that are NAUI instructors. Heck, even my wife has 2 out of 3 of her certs through NAUI. She asked me which agency to choose and I flat out told her she had to figure that one out on her own. So, I have to agree that in real life, I haven't seen the arguing like I do on this BB.

 

[Aquatic Eagle]

I have no freakin' idea, but it is really annoying that I can't post anything without somebody looking at my stats and bashing PADI, probably just to be annoying. I have very good friends that are NAUI instructors. Heck, even my wife has 2 out of 3 of her certs through NAUI. She asked me which agency to choose and I flat out told her she had to figure that one out on her own. So, I have to agree that in real life, I haven't seen the arguing like I do on this BB.

The most I've seen it outside of this board was when I worked for a cruise line. Most of the divers employed on a ship were PADI and when they found out I was NAUI they would harass me a little bit. It usually ended when I reminded them that yes, it was true that most cruise lines require an instructor to be PADI but that NASA only hires NAUI instructors.

In three years of working on ships I only ever encountered one other person who was NAUI and one person who was, I think, SSI. Everyone else was PADI.

 

[Walter]

Why do you think it is that there are constant agency wars between PADI and NAUI on boats and here on Scubaboard but you rarely see any warring or bashing between other agencies?

It's all in your mind. There are no agency wars. The agencies get along with each other and cooperate by recognizing each other's certifications. When I go diving, I ask my buddy about his experience and comfort level, but I don't ask him through which agency he's been certified.

What does happen is a potential diver or a new diver will discover that there is more than one agency. Usually they will know about PADI and learn about NAUI (or vice versa, but not as often), but sometimes it will be another agency. Since PADI is so big, it's almost always one of the two. That person will be curious and will ask about differences between the two agencies. Misinformed people will answer that there is no difference while others will explain the very real differences. The discussion often goes downhill pretty quickly into the "no difference" crowd calling those who point out differences elitists and compare the non-PADI approach to SEAL training (both of which are silly) and those who point out differences saying something stupid like PADI = Put Another Dollar In. There are those on both sides who do not engage in such childish behavior, but it's found in most of the threads. That childish behavior makes it look like there are agency wars when, in fact, none exist.

 

[PhilEllis]

While they don't make this public, I think you would find that the largest agencies cooperate quite well in the background. I have heard that in several instances, when lawsuits are filed against the other agencies, PADI will jump in and provide considerable legal assistance to the other agency without any expectations. Of course, in the legal world, you could make a great argument that the largest two or three agencies have a GREAT deal at stake when another agency is sued. The outcome of a lawsuit does, after all, affect each of them.

As was said previously, all of the agencies accept the training of the others, and all of the agencies allow students to move from one progression ladder to the other in the recreational realm, almost without exception.

Differences between agencies seem much more important to those who wish to engage in fun and enlightening debate than to those who actually run the agency businesses. Certainly, there will always be differences in training approach, differences in what the various agencies think constitutes a sound set of performance standards, and differences in how the agencies look upon their instructors and how they dictate how the instructors should proceed with a particular training curriculum.


Phil Ellis
www.divesports.com

 

[Aquatic Eagle]

It's all in your mind. There are no agency wars. The agencies get along with each other and cooperate by recognizing each other's certifications. When I go diving, I ask my buddy about his experience and comfort level, but I don't ask him through which agency he's been certified.

What does happen is a potential diver or a new diver will discover that there is more than one agency. Usually they will know about PADI and learn about NAUI (or vice versa, but not as often), but sometimes it will be another agency. Since PADI is so big, it's almost always one of the two. That person will be curious and will ask about differences between the two agencies. Misinformed people will answer that there is no difference while others will explain the very real differences. The discussion often goes downhill pretty quickly into the "no difference" crowd calling those who point out differences elitists and compare the non-PADI approach to SEAL training (both of which are silly) and those who point out differences saying something stupid like PADI = Put Another Dollar In. There are those on both sides who do not engage in such childish behavior, but it's found in most of the threads. That childish behavior makes it look like there are agency wars when, in fact, none exist.

That's why I mentioned agency wars here on SB and on the boat. I know there aren't any real problems between the actual agencies. I'm talking about wars between people about agencies.

 

[Walter]

Other than the childish name calling (elitist, Put Another...) I haven't seen wars about agencies here either. I've seen nothing remotely related to it on boats.

 

[MXGratefulDiver]

What I DO see on ScubaBoard ... increasingly more often ... is misinformation about what a given agency actually teaches. It usually comes from people who have never been affiliated with the agency they're talking about ... either as a student or an instructor. My impression is that they're simply parroting something they heard from someone at their LDS ... or read on the Internet.

... Bob (Grateful Diver)

 

[Teamcasa]

What you will see is a discussion that revolves around what new divers should have been trained in and what is lacking. Some feel many of these issue are life or death important and are passionate about it. While these discussion typically refer back to the agency the root is really a philosophical difference of opinion.

These debates ultimately self-destruct but before they do, many people read and gain a new and sometimes different insight to their own training. Overall, they benefit the reader.

 

[JeffG]

What I DO see on ScubaBoard ... increasingly more often ... is misinformation about what a given agency actually teaches. It usually comes from people who have never been affiliated with the agency they're talking about ... either as a student or an instructor. My impression is that they're simply parroting something they heard from someone at their LDS ... or read on the Internet.

... Bob (Grateful Diver)

Tell me it isn't so.