Question Checking the Level of Divers, so many new Agency's. All are legit ?

[Edward3c]

Because I don't keep a logbook, I had to do a check dive with the instructor.
It was charged at $40 instead of $25.
Since I had chosen a "wall dive" we took the opportunity to go a little deep and since we both knew how to handle the air well, some deco was necessary. The instructor with his computer and me for comparison with gauge, watch and tabel. That was the best dive on this boat because afterwards I was allowed (had to) play babbysitter.

When asked to ‘help out’ like you describe - I inform the operator it will cost them US$2,500 per dive, as I’m on holiday not working.

 

[B N Coleman]

Unfortunately, this will not provide a full list as other ISO certification bodies also issue SCUBA ISO’s, like SIS Certifications Pvt Ltd in India.

You are quite correct, and there are other companies, in countries around the world who evaluate / audit the ISO STDs/regulations, so it is good to check else-where, however, I have found that most agencies will have also applied to the EUF for accreditation to be able to offer diver training in the EU, it is a big market.

 

[Edward3c]

You are quite correct, and there are other companies, in countries around the world who evaluate / audit the ISO STDs/regulations, so it is good to check else-where, however, I have found that most agencies will have also applied to the EUF for accreditation to be able to offer diver training in the EU, it is a big market.

SIS have offices in the U.K. and around the world. The days of EUF dominance in diving ISO accreditation are coming to an end. Agencies, like PADI, will go out to tender for they’re next renewal.

As BSAC operate in Australia, I’m surprised you don’t know about us.

 

[Sascha314]

I basically know only check dives from egypt (no experience with liveaboard though).
First dive is a "welcome dive" at the house reef. So you dive with a guide and have to briefly show the basic skills. Clear half full mask. Clear emtpy mask. Regulator change to secondary. And of course a weight chdck. Then its a normal dive.

No experience with "advanced certifications". But from experience that is something ok. There are just lots of divers who dive very rarely and only on vacation...
Keeping that in mind I can understand this.

*edit* I have read here somewhere about judging how quick someone descents as a measure for the ability. Maybe I got that wrong, but if you are going for as little lead as possible to be as balanced as possible, you are descending slow. If you just sink fast, you are likely having too much lead.
Now that in combination with an inflsted BCD/Wing, maybe from check and/or to have plenty buyoncy to float, it just takes a couple of seconds to descent. Thats especially true for the first meter to break surface tension. So I do not think its an appropriate measure to judge a divers capability.
If you are talking about someone who descends, then go up again due to breathing pattern thats a completely different story.

 

[B N Coleman]

SIS have offices in the U.K. and around the world. The days of EUF dominance in diving ISO accreditation are coming to an end. Agencies, like PADI, will go out to tender for they’re next renewal.

As BSAC operate in Australia, I’m surprised you don’t know about us.

SIS have offices in the U.K. and around the world. The days of EUF dominance in diving ISO accreditation are coming to an end. Agencies, like PADI, will go out to tender for they’re next renewal.

As BSAC operate in Australia, I’m surprised you don’t know about us.

I am aware of this. My mention of EUF was simply to provide an option for checking agency credentials since they list many agencies. I am not promoting EUF, nor did I claim it is the only list or an exhaustive source of information.

I’m curious about your statement regarding PADI’s plans for their next renewal. Do you have direct insight into this? It would be interesting to understand how the tendering process might impact ISO accreditation in the industry.

 

[Edward3c]

I am aware of this. My mention of EUF was simply to provide an option for checking agency credentials since they list many agencies. I am not promoting EUF, nor did I claim it is the only list or an exhaustive source of information.

I’m curious about your statement regarding PADI’s plans for their next renewal. Do you have direct insight into this? It would be interesting to understand how the tendering process might impact ISO accreditation in the industry.

Like any business, I would be surprised if PADI didn’t test the market before getting into bed with a partner. There are loads of accredited bodies throughout the world issuing ISO certifications. SCUBA is not just the domain of the EUF.

Remember the certificate belongs to the certifying body, not the agency holding it.

The way ISO certification works for confirming currency it to contact your own ISO provider who will confirm the legitimacy of a specific certificate. I discovered one during a Governance Audit where the ISO auditor was assessing to an out of date standard; the certificate was consequently revoked.

 

[B N Coleman]

Thank you for the clarification and additional insight. I completely agree that ISO certification is not confined to any single body, such as EUF, and that there are many thousands of accredited organizations globally. It’s always prudent for any business, including PADI, to assess its options before partnering with a certifying body.

Your point about certificates belonging to the certifying body and the importance of validating credentials with an ISO provider is well taken. It highlights the importance of due diligence and maintaining up-to-date standards. Hence why I suggested reviewing the EUF.

The example you shared about an auditor using an outdated standard is a great reminder of how critical these checks are to the integrity of certifications.

That said, the EUF is often seen as a preferred auditor in the scuba industry because of their specific focus and consistent familiarity with the relevant standards for diving. This specialization can make them a strong option for agencies looking to maintain alignment with current and applicable ISO criteria.

Thanks again for sharing this perspective—it's always valuable to have these discussions.

Like any business, I would be surprised if PADI didn’t test the market before getting into bed with a partner. There are loads of accredited bodies throughout the world issuing ISO certifications. SCUBA is not just the domain of the EUF.

Remember the certificate belongs to the certifying body, not the agency holding it.

The way ISO certification works for confirming currency it to contact your own ISO provider who will confirm the legitimacy of a specific certificate. I discovered one during a Governance Audit where the ISO auditor was assessing to an out of date standard; the certificate was consequently revoked.

 

[Wibble]

I basically know only check dives from egypt (no experience with liveaboard though).
First dive is a "welcome dive" at the house reef. So you dive with a guide and have to briefly show the basic skills. Clear half full mask. Clear emtpy mask. Regulator change to secondary. And of course a weight chdck. Then its a normal dive.

No experience with "advanced certifications". But from experience that is something ok. There are just lots of divers who dive very rarely and only on vacation...
Keeping that in mind I can understand this.

*edit* I have read here somewhere about judging how quick someone descents as a measure for the ability. Maybe I got that wrong, but if you are going for as little lead as possible to be as balanced as possible, you are descending slow. If you just sink fast, you are likely having too much lead.
Now that in combination with an inflsted BCD/Wing, maybe from check and/or to have plenty buyoncy to float, it just takes a couple of seconds to descent. Thats especially true for the first meter to break surface tension. So I do not think its an appropriate measure to judge a divers capability.
If you are talking about someone who descends, then go up again due to breathing pattern thats a completely different story.

It’s how a diver descends. In control? Appropriate speed, not plummeting. Slowing as the bottom arrives, not hitting the bottom nor overcompensating. In appropriate trim, not feet first. Using their buoyancy properly, not wild variations. Tidy in the water, not stuff everywhere. Calm not agitated. And when on the bottom… still and calm, not flailing around and constantly finning. Efficient finning, not flapping madly and kicking the crap out of the environment. Aware of what’s happening around them.

It’s easy to assess both ends of the spectrum, smelling the b*llsh!t from the roses.

 

[Sascha314]

@Wibble
100% agree, thanks. I was too lazy to quote, so actually Instumbled over this

I've often seen DMs tell everyone on the first dive that we'd all descend together, and to wait on the surface until all were in. The, thumbs down, and anyone NOT scending quickly was picked out as a potential problem and handed another weight or two. [...]

My comment was for this: I do want to descend slowly, because I do not want to carry too much lead(unless negative entry etc., but that does not seem to be of question here).

So I would be picked as a beginner / unexperienced diver and get additional unnecessary weight? According to this description. Or did I get this wrong maybe? If I am not wrong, I disagree with this judgment method.

 

[CG43]

Hello Edward

When asked to ‘help out’ like you describe - I inform the operator it will cost them US$2,500 per dive, as I’m on holiday not working.

If it is known that you have an instructor certificat, they may ask you.

Otherwise this is done simply by dividing the divers into buddy groups.
A certificate is first of all a sheet of plastic.
Some divers earn it, others diver don't.
The professionals I met usually had a good sense of forming functioning buddy groups as long as this was possible. Divers have their own tricks.

One of my friends went diving with two friends to the red sea. They are all highly certificated but only showed their OWD (or similar) at the dive center. On the boat, the guid was still looking for places for divers in buddy groups. He saw the three friends and said to them: Are you kidding me?
You are never just OWD diver !
But they replied : We are OWD .
No other diver came into their group.