Adequacy of OW and AOW

Was your OW and AOW training adequate

  • Yes, it gave me the skills to assess risk and to survive emergencies

    Votes: 58 31.2%
  • For the most part

    Votes: 85 45.7%
  • No, I needed to learn a lot more to be safe within the certification limits

    Votes: 43 23.1%

  • Total voters
    186

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halemanō;5864269:
THIS IS A MYTH!!!! :no:

The vast majority of typical recreational OW training courses are marketed as 3-day courses. In order for the vast majority to complete the course in 3 days they would need to; finish all the book/dvd/eLearning/homework prior to showing up at the start of day 1, be relatively fit and relatively comfortable snorkeling, and be able to put up with a relatively grueling schedule for those 3 days.

I would say the vast majority of the last decade's new divers "signed up" for 3-day courses, but I seriously doubt that even a majority of those who signed up for 3-day courses completed OW certification in 3-days. :shakehead:

I was handed my book the day before the course started and told to read the first 100 pages before next day where we did first session in the pool. An evening of reading and out on the boat the next day for dives 1 and 2. Coursework over lunch and on the drive back in. Dives 3 and 4 on the third day with more reading while the boat was driving out to the sites. Then all certified in 3 days (PADI OW) -- I wouldn't say it was hard or even a grueling schedule even considering the fact I'd never even snorkeled before.
 
I was handed my book the day before the course started and told to read the first 100 pages before next day where we did first session in the pool. An evening of reading and out on the boat the next day for dives 1 and 2. Coursework over lunch and on the drive back in. Dives 3 and 4 on the third day with more reading while the boat was driving out to the sites. Then all certified in 3 days (PADI OW) -- I wouldn't say it was hard or even a grueling schedule even considering the fact I'd never even snorkeled before.

And a 29 year old male who vacations in Koh Lanta, Thailand, has less than 24 dives, was just certified in Janurary yet already owns Sherwood Trek Fins, Sherwood SM1 Mask, Sherwood Absolute Dry Snorkle, Akona 7mm boots, HOG D1 Coldwater First stage & 2 x D1 second stages, Zeagle Tech BC, Bare Elastek 3mm Full, Tusa Compact 3 Gauge Console AND has already made 35 posts to ScubaBoard is REALLY representative of the vast majority of this centuries new divers. :rofl3:

Even for the exceptional, how does one define weekend? :idk:
 
halemanō;5864437:
And a 29 year old male who vacations in Koh Lanta, Thailand, has less than 24 dives, was just certified in Janurary yet already owns Sherwood Trek Fins, Sherwood SM1 Mask, Sherwood Absolute Dry Snorkle, Akona 7mm boots, HOG D1 Coldwater First stage & 2 x D1 second stages, Zeagle Tech BC, Bare Elastek 3mm Full, Tusa Compact 3 Gauge Console AND has already made 35 posts to ScubaBoard is REALLY representative of the vast majority of this centuries new divers. :rofl3:

Even for the exceptional, how does one define weekend? :idk:

Hmmm ... replace that Zeagle Tech with a basic jacket BCD and I'd say that makes him pretty "normal" ... :D

cuyler ... I'd sit this one out before you get labelled a "techspurt" and made the subject of the next installment in the "Warped World" series ...

... Bob (Grateful Diver)
 
halemanō;5864437:
And a 29 year old male who vacations in Koh Lanta, Thailand, has less than 24 dives, was just certified in Janurary yet already owns Sherwood Trek Fins, Sherwood SM1 Mask, Sherwood Absolute Dry Snorkle, Akona 7mm boots, HOG D1 Coldwater First stage & 2 x D1 second stages, Zeagle Tech BC, Bare Elastek 3mm Full, Tusa Compact 3 Gauge Console AND has already made 35 posts to ScubaBoard is REALLY representative of the vast majority of this centuries new divers. :rofl3:

Even for the exceptional, how does one define weekend? :idk:

My gear has nothing to do with anything - just means I'm a sucker for online shopping. As for number of dives - that just means I was someone who recently was shopping for getting an OW cert. I would hazard a guess that most people don't get more than one OW cert and yes, there are people who have worked in many dive shops, teaching around the world and the such that could do a proper sample. I was just adding some helpful info. In my research I'd guess 80% advertised the OW in 3 days, a few did it over 4. Doing it in 3 wasn't difficult and I would consider myself an average Joe. In speaking with other travelers who did their OW in India before diving with us in Thailand their course setup was similar to us in terms of schedule and they were fine as well.

As for the question at hand - do I feel that the 3 day OW prepared me. I'd say no. Part of my reason for continuing following this board is to learn - part of figuring out what you don't know. When you don't know what you don't know that's dangerous. I actually found the OW course bad in that respect - it gives the impression of skill I know I don't really have. I don't know how to use a SMB, how to handle a sudden tingly feeling that can happen with paralysis while diving, dealing with a panicked partner, risks of boat crew shutting off your valve, etc... All things not covered or mentioned in the course. I think at the end of the OW course ever student should be handed the book Diver Down just to show them how many things can go wrong. Because of that I've switched to the long hose and a couple other things as well as signed up for my rescue course.
 
Hmmm ... replace that Zeagle Tech with a basic jacket BCD and I'd say that makes him pretty "normal" ... :D

cuyler ... I'd sit this one out before you get labelled a "techspurt" and made the subject of the next installment in the "Warped World" series ...

... Bob (Grateful Diver)

Thanks Bob, didn't mean to stir the pot or anything. Just tried to add a recent OW view as opposed to someone with 500 dives that remembers the OW course with rose tinted glasses. :)
 
halemanō;5864437:
And a 29 year old male who vacations in Koh Lanta, Thailand, has less than 24 dives, was just certified in Janurary yet already owns Sherwood Trek Fins, Sherwood SM1 Mask, Sherwood Absolute Dry Snorkle, Akona 7mm boots, HOG D1 Coldwater First stage & 2 x D1 second stages, Zeagle Tech BC, Bare Elastek 3mm Full, Tusa Compact 3 Gauge Console AND has already made 35 posts to ScubaBoard is REALLY representative of the vast majority of this centuries new divers.

He does seem to have a better grasp on the reality than yourself. :idk:

I guess it must be more a case that common sense, observation and not living in a self-sustaining delusion aids his perception. :rofl3:

Also, it seems a pretty cheap shot to ridicule this person's observations, on the basis of his experience. It seems that anyone with more experience than yourself is criticised as a 'techspurt', and anyone with less experience than yourself is written off as irrelevant. That leaves you as the only person with a credible foundation of experience and valid viewpoint. I think you need to check your ego.

halemanō;5864269:
THIS IS A MYTH!!!!
nonononono.gif


The vast majority of typical recreational OW training courses are marketed as 3-day courses. In order for the vast majority to complete the course in 3 days they would need to; finish all the book/dvd/eLearning/homework prior to showing up at the start of day 1, be relatively fit and relatively comfortable snorkeling, and be able to put up with a relatively grueling schedule for those 3 days.

I would say the vast majority of the last decade's new divers "signed up" for 3-day courses, but I seriously doubt that even a majority of those who signed up for 3-day courses completed OW certification in 3-days.
shakehead.gif

For someone who typically crusades on this forum in protest of members who post unsubstantiated drivel as if it were fact, and who fail to provide any evidence to support their views - your post, and attitude, certainly seem like a major hypocritical blunder.

For example:

On Koh Tao... a small island in Thailand, whose dive centres produce over 10,000 certifications a year, the average course length is 3 days. The island typically caters for a young backpacker market, who are not necessarily the most fit, or most focused, students. Nonetheless, those students experience little difficulty achieving the course requirements. Simular situations exist in other locations that I have dived at around Asia. 3-day courses were also the norm in Malaysia and Indonesia...again, the pass rate was extremely high and a student no being able to reach the standard was a very rare event.

A typical Thailand OW schedule would be as follows:

Day 1:
AM: OW Theory Chap 1-3
PM: OW Confined 1-5

Day 2:
AM: OW Theory Chap 4-5
PM: OW Dives 1-2

Day 3:
AM: OW Exam
PM: OW Dives 3-4

From my experience on Koh Tao, the pass rate for this 'model' of OW course is very close to 100%. In the time that I worked on Koh Tao, I trained in excess of 200 students and, from those, only had 3 students that failed to achieve OW certification. One girl had a phobia of water and couldn't complete confined water training. Another girl couldn't achieve a mask remove & replace, so qualified as a Scuba Diver (not OW). Another student failed to attend for day 3 of the course (believed that he departed the island with a new love interest).
 
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I was handed my book the day before the course started and told to read the first 100 pages before next day where we did first session in the pool. An evening of reading and out on the boat the next day for dives 1 and 2. Coursework over lunch and on the drive back in. Dives 3 and 4 on the third day with more reading while the boat was driving out to the sites. Then all certified in 3 days (PADI OW) -- I wouldn't say it was hard or even a grueling schedule even considering the fact I'd never even snorkeled before.

OK, let's start with the fact that 3 days is 50% more than a weekend.

I was also certified in 3 days, probably in very much the same fashion as you described above. It was not until much later that I learned what was supposed to be covered in my course and realized how much (how very, very much), had been left out.

I suspect that if you were to compare what you did with the actual requirements for the course, you would see same thing I did, and you would be tempted to report the operator for its failure to meet standards.
 
Warped Dive World Evolution - BP/W Subgroup Mindset:
halemano's post #354:
AFAIR, I have only pointed out when "Techspurts" type their opinion as if it were fact! If the "Techspurts" could type their opinion as opinion, I would then only perhaps type my opinion.

At most, the SB member I quoted in that post could feel "labeled" - another seems to have labeled himself. :kiss2:

Yes, my Warped View of the Dive World is that less than 50% of this centuries newly certified OW divers who signed up for 3-day OW certification courses received their cert card after only 3 days with their OW instructor (and at least part of a prior day on homework). :D

My Warped View of the Dive World also includes the feeling that ...

halemanō;5864269:
In order for the vast majority to complete the course in 3 days I think they would need to; finish all the book/dvd/eLearning/homework prior to showing up at the start of day 1, be relatively fit and relatively comfortable snorkeling, and be able to put up with a relatively grueling schedule for those 3 days.

It is evidently in the best interests of many SB members to "claim" today's scuba diving instruction is "less than safe" - in order for them to be able to sell you something. :shocked2:

I objected to...

It seems that a lot of new divers get their certification quickly over a weekend these days

But evidently, to sell more training and some SMB's, NOT talking about the prevalence of such training MYTHS is how SB rolls. :shakehead:
 
Who is SB?

And what is a techspurt? Sure sounds messy, but who knows ... might be kinda fun ... :wink:

... Bob (Grateful Diver)
 
OK, let's start with the fact that 3 days is 50% more than a weekend.

Unless, of course, it's a holiday week-end ... :D

... Bob (Grateful Diver)
 
https://www.shearwater.com/products/swift/

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