Abandoned at Sea - Sun June 26, 2005 - The Ibis, Dania Beach, Hollywood Fl.

[lhpdiver]

I don't agree with naming names in posts such as this. These things lay around on the internet for years, often times you only get one side of the story... The captain who gets too close to a kayaker, the Instructor who gets in trouble in Mexico. The message can be just as loud without names.

Shifting gears - head counts, roll calls - what happened to FLAG count ? (and flag location)

 

[Web Monkey]

There really is no other side to the story, a diver left at sea is a diver left at sea and there are NO acceptable excuses for it. Divers are trusting the boat to still be there when they surface and if it isn't, I cannot imagine the fear. Glad to see that "this time" it turned out ok.

It's not all that scary to be left, if you're in a busy area with a reasonable amount of boat traffic and you have a big SMB and an Air-Horn (keep forgetting the name - Scubalert?). (was left in Fla once)

I suspect that being left in a remote area with no traffic would require a change of shorts if/when you get back.

Terry

 

[ReefGuy]

This is no different than an editorial in a newspaper. You see names there all the time, right? This is an issue of safety, and could cost someone a life.

Furthermore, the staff has contacted the business in question, which is more than they'd get if the post was in a newspaper or something. They know this thread is going and that they are getting negative publicity over this, and they have the ability to respond. It's happened here before, and the business came out the better for it (see the thread on "almost left behind" or something like that).

Also, wasn't it put forward that the captain LIED about his response to the Coast Guard? Lied about making an attempt to improve the problem? This by other divers with no relation to the one posting the original post.

I do hope that they respond here. I would like to hear their side of the story. Frankly, knowing they're aware about this thread, if they don't post, it means one of two things to me: either they don't care about their customers, or they have nothing of value to add. In either case, I wouldn't want to use them as a dive op.

Are they on trial here? Yes. Is it unfair? No. Businesses are constantly under the trial of public opinion in many forums. This is only one.

I don't agree with naming names in posts such as this. These things lay around on the internet for years, often times you only get one side of the story... The captain who gets too close to a kayaker, the Instructor who gets in trouble in Mexico. The message can be just as loud without names.

Shifting gears - head counts, roll calls - what happened to FLAG count ? (and flag location)

 

[DennisW]

There is absolutely no excuse for leaving divers behind. As said before, head counts don't work. My only requirement for an operator is that they get me to the dive site and they get me back to shore. That is what I pay them for. If they don't follow proper safetly procedures like a roll call, having oxygen available and operational, life vests readily available, etc. I will never use them again. A roll call is just as important as having life vests on board.

Now, if I am on board a six pack and the captain is there with the divers, he may choose not to do a roll call. It is very easy to make sure you have 6 divers back on the boat. I will not fault him in this situation. However, big boats with lots of divers get extremely confusing right after a dive, especially after the second dive and people are stowing gear, the deck hands are getting the boat ready to go to the dock and the captain is trying to make sure he/she gets back to the dock on time. You just cannot do head counts in this situation and make it work. It is dangerous.

Thanks for the post. I'll remember the name of the boat at least and will not dive on it.

 

[Li'l38]

It's not all that scary to be left, if you're in a busy area with a reasonable amount of boat traffic and you have a big SMB and an Air-Horn (keep forgetting the name - Scubalert?). (was left in Fla once)

Not all that scary??? Maybe, if you know you won't be lost at sea... This can take a dive trip or otherwise enjoyable vacation from a great experience to a big hassle or worse... This isn't just about the very bad ending that fortunately didn't happen. This is about the future of the diving industry. Accidents can and DO happen. Safety should be everyone's #1 concern. It's why we practice what to do in particular circumstances. (lose your mask, OOA, etc.)

I suspect that being left in a remote area with no traffic would require a change of shorts if/when you get back.

Terry

Forgive me here, one would tend to think that you are a brave soul or quite possibly unconcerned for fellow divers. There are so many new divers that don't know/realize procedures or even what to ask of a dive op. We all learn about risks when learning to dive (hopefully.) I had no idea how much about dive boat operation that I would have to keep in mind when I first started diving. After all, I was learning to dive, not operate a dive boat. (and I haven't seen the movie Open Water) Our knowledge is gained form experience and/or learning from others. THANK GOD FOR ScubaBoard!!! IMO it should be industry standard to use the most effective method to ensure everyone's safety. AT ALL TIMES!!! And should not be taken lightly! This tagging/ peg board idea seems like the best way to avoid leaving divers in the water. Cost effective as well, plastic is cheap! A back-up plan is a good idea too. What's a few miutes to take a roll call? vs. the risk of something bad happening. If I owned a dive op..... As a business owner (of any type business) your reputation is your business card. It might mean the difference between success or failure of what one hopes to be their income. I'm sure if something bad happened to someone closer to you (someone within you monkey-sphere) your opinion would be different. I've learned a lot since joining SB. After reading this thread, I'm so glad to know that other divers are doing their best to improve the industry, for the good of ALL of us. There is always room for improvement. "Chance favors the prepared mind"- Louis Pasteur

 

[StSomewhere]

FWIW, the idea of DAN's tagging system is OK in theory, but is expensive as all getout. No need to pay the big bucks, a boat owner could do something similar for about 1/10th the $$$.

 

[Web Monkey]

FWIW, the idea of DAN's tagging system is OK in theory, but is expensive as all getout. No need to pay the big bucks, a boat owner could do something similar for about 1/10th the $$$.

Wasn't it free to DAN business members? Did this change?

Terry

 

[Web Monkey]

Not all that scary??? Maybe, if you know you won't be lost at sea...

That was my point. If the boat takes off without you and there are others nearby, take any boat you can get.

The "not my boat" mindset is very dangerous. If you can't find your boat, any boat you can get to is your boat.

Like any other incident or equipment failure, being left behind is an unsettling experience, especially when you start to realize how much you were not taught in OW class.

The SSI OW book, for example has exactly one page titled "Signaling Devices", only gives a single paragraph describing the existance of SMBs, contains no instructions on how to deploy it, and makes no mention that the most common need for emergency signalling, is to attract attention when your boat isn't there.

I wasn't saying getting left behind is pleasant or insignificant, I was only saying that if it happens in a popular area with other boats around, you should be able to get somebody's attention and get a ride.

Any time you're in the open water, you need the ability to make yourself as big, bright, buoyant and noisy as possible

Forgive me here, one would tend to think that you are a brave soul or quite possibly unconcerned for fellow divers.

I'm neither. I was only saying that having your boat take off in a busy area isn't as scary as having your boat take off when there's nobody around.

In any event, be prepared, whatever it takes. Since I was left, I started carrying 2 9' SMBs (orange and yellow), a Scubalert (tank-powered air horn), and a strobe.

I haven't been diving in any remote areas, but if I did, I'd probably bring an EPIRB (Electronic Position Indicating Radio Beacon).

The biggest thing to remember about boat diving is that there is a (very small) possibility that when you return, there will be no boat, and you need to be prepared.

Terry

 

[MoonWrasse]

I don't agree with naming names in posts such as this. These things lay around on the internet for years, often times you only get one side of the story... The captain who gets too close to a kayaker, the Instructor who gets in trouble in Mexico. The message can be just as loud without names.

Happens all the time in obituaries. Fortunately that wasn't the case in this incident. There's no chance to blame death on "diver error" or "heart attack".

The guy in question has been provided the opportunity to respond here, and thus far hasn't.

 

[Canadian_Diver]

... one of the many reasons I prefer smaller dive operations / boats.

Here's to the smaller boats. :thumbs-up