A very bad week in Florida

[Bruciebabe]

I beleive you should name names. Not here since its a TOS violation (dumb policy).

But on your website and over on TDS. Give people enough information to make their own judgements about instructors.

Done. On my site.
I have nothing to worry because I have only told the truth.

 

[rjack321]

I am not making judgments on your class experience, you clearly clashed. One possible reason for that was the emphasis you placed on agency affilations. As many before me have said, its really all about the instructor. A through vetting process is just about mandatory for cave/deco etc. student-instructor relationships.

I found his brief bio quite interesting:

"CI is one of the UK and worlds most qualified Instructor and Instructor Trainers. Able to teach courses from IANTD, TDI, DAN and both of the major Cave Diver training agencies (NACD and NSS-CDS) he brings a wealth of experience and expertise not always available from other dive centres. A keen wreck diver, CI's real passion is cave diving and rebreathers, and he is the first ever IANTD CCR Cave Instructor Trainer. All of this means any course with CI will not only be exciting and fun, but the very best in diver education."

Asking for prior student references is really mandatory. That is why I find the TOS on this board silly. We can discuss our gear experiences but not instructors. The latter usually have as much or greater impacts on our diving as your example shows.

 

[JimC]

The funny thing is that the agency you received your training from is completely meaningless in almost every cave on the planet. In fact, the fact that you're cave trained isn't even relevant as far as access goes. All you need is land owner permission, and most of them don't give a rats *** what training you have.

As rjack mentioned, its all about the instructor. Get good instruction, then find a mentor doing the dives you want to do. The mentor bit is especially true when you get out of the caves you need the cards for. The agency on your card is simply irrelevant outside of publicly owned and commercial run systems in Florida and Mexico - a tinny amount of caves in the grand scheme of things.

 

[GreenDiverDown]

Asking for prior student references is really mandatory.

Hugely important! That's how I picked my instructor... not by the agency... not by a list of accomplishments. I went to the people that I knew that I could trust for a recommendation. They didn't let me down!

 

[rjack321]

I see that your instructor has responded to your class report over on TDS. Others may find the other side of the story interesting as well.

http://thedecostop.com/forums/showthread.php?t=22712

 

[GreenDiverDown]

Very telling and IMHO, very unprofessional. I hope TDS quickly sacks it.

 

[amascuba]

This was posted as a response to ScubaBrucie on TDS:

http://thedecostop.com/forums/showthread.php?t=22712

As Bruce has decided to "go public" with his bad week in Florida on his own web site, but has blocked my own psot outlining my side of the story I would like to post my response here. You can read his report on his site.

I would ask everyone to accept my apologies in advance if this falls outside of the rules of the deco stop.

The first comment and those subsequently in blue are from Tom Mount

My comments are below (in blue)and I do think you should send this to Everiss
Grand Master Tom Mount D.Sc.,Ph.D.,N.D.

Chairman Board of Directors IANTD
Past Life Therapy
Energy Health and Wellness Consulting
Underwater Survival Training
Martial Arts Survival Training
----- Original Message -----
From: Martin Robson
To: IANTD World HQ Miami ; John P. Jones ; Iantdpro@aol.com
Cc: Joseph Dituri (TD IANTD)
Sent: Thursday, March 29, 2007 12:34 PM
Subject: Re: attn Tom Mount


Dear Tom,

Thank you for bringing this matter to my attention. Obviously I am somewhat distressed and concerned about the nature of these allegations.

I should not have to defend myself as I have always tried my level best to maintain the highest level of professionalism, but in this case I feel as if I have little choice.

Mr. Everiss sought me out via the internet for a Cave Diver course. The course was OC Cave. Prior to the course I was under the impression that he did not really want to do the course with me as he stated quite clearly "XX is of course a much better Instructor than you, I am only doing the course with you to get all the plastic cards".

This of course did not endear me to Mr. Everiss but I continued forward with the course as professionally as I could.

Everiss came to the class as an IANTD Intro to Cave certification, but on questioning him over skills learnt and dives done it became clear he had forgotten a lot from that class. I did ask if he had forgotten or was it a case of not being taught in the first place? I asked this not to judge another Instructor but to establish a start point for the course and to ascertain what, if any skills that I should expect him to have, would need reviewing.

I have outlined below a synopsis of each training day (not including academic presentations) to highlight some of Everiss' difficulties. These observations are taken from a log of the dives which was written, whenever possible, after each dive, not just at the end of the day. The other issues I will address at the end of this report.

Kit configuration. An equipment configuration session was held prior to leaving the dive centre to ensure that Everiss' kit was neatly and correctly configured and that all the components were functioning correctly. During this session I was told by Everiss that as he had read a book called "Dress for Success" my comments and suggestions were a) not needed and b) would be ignored in favour of the information form the book which was superior to my teaching.
At this point I think I would have informed him, he would at least during the course abide by my rules- unless he could logically defend the use of a better configuration on its personal merits not by what someone else has said. By the way I have never heard of this book

Dive 1. OW skills. Weighting/buoyancy. pre-dive matching, S-drill and gas calculations. Line laying exercises, OOA drills along the line, touch contact drills, air-sharing (long hose deployment), valve shut downs. Having demonstrated line techniques on dry land an OX dive was conducted at Orange Grove to practice these in water. I conducted the pre-dive checks etc. but was surprised he had completely forgotten these from his Intro class. The line laying was done to a moderate standard and the exercises were completed. The main problem was that Everiss' body position was very upright and he was using flutter kicks not frog kicking as I had requested. When asked to conduct a valve shutdown drill (following a talk through on dry land and a demonstration under water) he was not able to reach his valves at all.
b
Dive 2. An unexpected flood in my dry suit caused me to abort the dive after just a few minutes. However before this I did go through the pre-dive checks and asked Everiss to try a valve shutdown drill. Again he was no where near to reaching his valves. He informed me that this was unimportant as he was already Intro, a Trimix diver and GUE fundamentals and therefore I should know he can perform this task and it didn't matter if he couldn't do it for me.
b
Dive 3. Conducted on the same day as Dive 2 after I had repaired my dry suit. We repeated line laying and touch contact drills. I then asked Everiss to try again to reach his valves but with no success. In order not to end the day on a low despite not achieving a valve shut down, I took Everiss into the cavern at orange Grove and up to the start of the gold line in order to have a look in to the cave as "look forward" to the diving we would be doing. He expressed is thanks and said how wonderful the caves were.

Dive 4 & 5. Peacock - Olsen - Peacock

The dive was conducted at a good swim pace, but Everiss buoyancy control, body position and fining technique (mainly OW flutter kick in the cave) needed a lot of work if he were to reach the required standard. Everiss tangled himself in his own primary line. He also used his hands to almost continually to aid his swimming, thus stirring a lot of silt. I noted in my log that for a trimix diver his buoyancy control was atrocious. Exited the cave on back-up lights. Asked Everiss to reach valves whilst in the cavern zone. He was not able to do so, and I halted the drill after 3 - 4 minutes of his trying but without success. This was due to his repeatedly crashing in to the floor of the cavern and jeopardising the visibility.

Time for him to practice for an hour or two in the basin on valves and kicks o\or at least do kicks in his bed at night -this is actually what I expected to be reading when he wrote as it is the now recognized comments of a student who just wants a card

Dive 6. Peacock 1 - Peanut Line.

Swam to 200 feet to exit practising a number of air sharing skills. This was repeated several times with Everiss as donor and recipient. Went back in to 300 feet to practice a touch contact exit. Everiss did not hold on to the line for the duration of the exit, lost control of his buoyancy and I had to assist him from the roof of the cave.
This should be posted on his list

 

[rjack321]

Pheeeew, that laundry stinks!

Whatever happened happened. Its over, move on.

 

[amascuba]

Dive 7. Peacock - Crossover via Olsen line.

Again progress through the cave was good. Following my suggestion Everiss purchased a set of "gaiters" to wear around his calves and these made a significant improvement to his body position. However despite a slight improvement in fining technique he used his fins as "buoyancy thrusters" and anytime he stopped forward motion he would sink/crash into to the floor and into the silt. Everiss was still using his hands to aid his swimming and buoyancy.

At this point you have more patience than I - my assignment would be practice in basin until you show me a reason I should risk my life and take you into a cave-

Dive 8. Peacock 1 - Crossover via peanut line to complete the circuit.

Everiss again used his hands to aid swimming through the cave. Gain entangled himself in his own line. When slowing down or carrying out other tasks such as line laying he is sinking straight to the floor. In the crossover tunnel he put one arm more that wrist deep into the floor of the cave. Communications and light signals were improving all the time. At the end of the dive we swam back into the Peanut line to approximately 300 feet to repeat the touch contact exercise. Again Everiss let go of the line, lost control of his buoyancy and had to be assisted form the roof of the cave. Everiss was not able to perform a valve shutdown whilst in the cavern zone.

I admire your patience as I would have cut him looses until he could do valve shutdown and buoyancy control with body posture correctly. No reason to allow someone to kill you if they cannot do the dives

Dive 9. Little River

Everiss continued to use his hands to "doggy paddle" through the cave, and OW fining techniques when not appropriate for the environment. Each of the jumps that Everiss set involved his hitting the floor with either hands, knees or fins. Everiss is still not able to perform a valve shut down.

Did you consider making him hold onto his bc hose and waist strap so his hands could not be used-again I would not have him on this dive until he could do valve shutdowns as his and perhaps my life may depend on it

Dive 10. Cow Spring (Downstream)

A number of short dives were conducted in downstream Cow Spring to practice/repeat the following exercises. Touch contact exit. Touch contact exit with air sharing (with Everiss as donor and recipient and leading and as No 2) and then two lost line drills. The first was conducted with light, the second in a simulated (blacked out) silt out. Everiss recovered the line quickly on the first, and whilst slower, was again successful on the second.

Dive 11. Ginnie - Devil's Ear

It was intended to undertake the expressway Circuit but Everiss did not have sufficient gas to complete the set-up. Buoyancy was better in the higher flow, but when setting the fist jump he went completely upright in the cave and allowed his fins, whilst not actually touching the floor, to significantly disturb the silt and affect visibility.
In removal and replacement of his decompression stage he knelt on the floor. I asked Everiss to perform a valve shut down in the OW of the head pool.. This occasion was the first time he completed the drill, whilst kneeling on the floor.

could he do the drill in swimming posture yet??

Dive 12.

Everiss seemed to be in such a hurry to enter the cave that instead of waiting for a team ahead of him to complete laying their own primary he pushed past them, kicking one team member in the head and effectively splitting their team. He also repeated the mistake from previous dives of failing to notice exiting teams and not giving them priority. On this dive he blocked the way for exiting teams on three occasions. Everiss jump line recovery was an improvement on setting the jumps and was of a reasonable standard. Everiss was asked to perform a valve shutdown whilst in the cave environment but was not able to do so and repeatedly hit either the ceiling or the floor when attempting this drill.
Martin, at this point I think you should have kept him out of the cave for his and the safety of other divers as well as your own life- at dive 12 if he still could not do basic skills he really has no place in a cave environment and you should have told him so and said good bye until he was ready to dive safely


Dive 13. Orange Grove

A much better dive from Everiss. An overall improvement in swimming but still using hands to swim, and OW flutter kicks whenever his buoyancy is not correct. Used OW fining techniques throughout the cavern zone when laying the primary line. Lost diver procedure on exit with a good search being conducted by Everiss.

Dive 14. Telford.

Everiss was unable to control his buoyancy and lay the primary line at the same time, resulting in his entanglement within just a few feet of the entrance. An improvement in body position to a point where it is consistent and of an acceptable standard. Could not progress through the cave without continually touching the floor or walls even when not appropriate for the cave passage. Setting of gaps was done well especially considering other teams had already set theirs along similar routes. Exiting the caves was not able to repeat this and entangled himself in his won gap lines and needed assistance to correct the problem. Disconnected another team's primary at the exit.
At this point I would have told him to come back next year once he had practiced skills- I think we all get challenges and many was this guy a challenge for you- You fear tolerance is higher than mine as by now I would have been terrified to be in the water with this person

Dive 15. Peacock - Nicholson - Cisteen

Again Everiss entangled himself in his own primary line whilst line laying. Body position was good. Buoyancy was ok until tasked. At each of the jumps Everiss set he either touched the floor with hands, knees or fins, or when not touching, constantly finned (OW flutter kicks) and caused a great deal of silt to be disturbed and a reduction in visibility. At one point his technique was so bad I was tempted to call the dive early, but mindful of how much he was struggling to master the techniques and how hard he was working to achieve this I wanted to make sure he had every opportunity to practice and demonstrate his skills. Valve shut down was not completed and Everiss crashed into the floor of the cave five times before I decided to halt the drill.
time to say good by to him he has no business in a cave as he will kill himself or someone else- you are being too nice and with this diver skill it is apparent he is not ready and should be discouraged from both cave and wreck diving

Dive 16 & 17. Peacock - Olsen via (Peanut and Crossover) and return to Peacock

Much better primary line but Everiss still did not correct his buoyancy prior to any task, hence still hitting the floor or having to fin constantly to correct his buoyancy. His fins were on the floor when the jumps were set, but buoyancy when swimming was better. Body position still good. Passage through the Crossover Tunnel in both directions was much better than previous visits but again Everiss put his hands in the floor when recovering the jump reels. Everiss managed to reach his valves and perform a valve shutdown in the cave but in order to achieve this had to fin constantly (OW fining) and turn through 360 degrees several times which resulted in his becoming entangled in the main line.
question you have to ask is would he have survived a real situation or would he have jeopardized a buddy - you are far braver than I to keep going into a cave with this performance -

At the end of each dive I took time to tell Everiss where he needed to make improvements and how this could be done. This was reinforced with demonstrations in-water where possible.

During each debrief Everiss seemed not to be interested in my observations and critique and rather than take onboard what I was trying to say would dismiss it as either factually incorrect or of little importance. For example when I told him how much the visibility became reduce after his arm had sunk more then wrist deep into the silt Everiss told me it was not important as he could still see, and that it didn't matter in the long term because the water flow would eventually remove evidence of his have touched the floor so heavily. He also stated during these debriefs that he was not able to recall what had happened during these dives.
does he have ADD I assume you did fail him big time as I would hate to see him kill someone in a cave- and with this attitude and dive skills he will

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[amascuba]

I have to admit that the Instructor/student relationship was a little strained during Everiss' course. I have to attribute this to Everiss attitude toward me and what I was trying to get him to do. For every debrief and suggestion there was a litany of excuses from him, all of which were irrelevant to the point I was trying to make. He seemed bitterly disappointed at the fact he was having to take a course (to get the "plastic cards" he wanted) with someone who was, in his words and opinion , "not famous". I spent the week listening to how "I am a better diver than you really and XXX is a better Instructor and XXX is famous, but you aren't are you". I would say that at no point until the end of the course did I make any adversarial comment about these insults to Everiss. Even on the last day Everiss told me that his inability to do a valve drill should not be taken into account as he was "already GUE certified and a Trimix diver so I must know he has done it hundreds of times so it doesn't matter that I haven't seen him do it".

After the course had concluded, whist at dinner, Everiss then told me I was "of no value as an Instructor". He also expressed an opinion of how "well known" question what is he well know for and to whom he is in the diving community and what he was "capable of". I spoke of his comments with a colleague and following this discussion I was advised to, if possible, remove my signature from Everiss' log book. I had previously expressed my reluctance to sign an incomplete log book, but did so out of trust and as part of being Everiss' course Instructor. With hindsight I should not have signed these pages. I removed my signature to avoid Everiss claiming completion of a course and trying to gain certification. I have made provision to replace the altered pages.
As long as you signed off his incompetence I do not think you would have a issue

Throughout my time as a diver and Instructor I have dived with and taught people with whom I did not get along on a personal level. This has never prevented me from doing what I enjoy the most which is teaching. Even in those circumstances where students and I have not got on I have never had anyone complain like this, even if the students have not passed their course.

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