(6/28/2005) Like your exercise? Ever been bent? Read this

[jonnythan]

Good point Pug, one that I stupidly thought was obvious.

No computer is going to know that you're dehydrated. No computer is going to know that you were drinking the night before. No computer is going to know that you were working out 10 minutes before dive time. No computer is going to know that you were smoking as you were gearing up. No computer is going to know you have a PFO. No computer is going to know you have a body fat percentage of 50%. No computer is going to know that you're 80 years old.

Even *with* a computer you need to use your head. If there are factors that may contribute to your getting DCS on the next dive, you need to think about that and adjust conservatism in your *head*. Trusting a computer, even a "conservative" one, to its edge, especially when there are complicating factors the computer doesn't know about, is asking for a hit.

 

[jonnythan]

so the exercise wasn't immediately preceeding or proceeding a dive.....what's your point?

Uh, that it was two days before.

I think it's safe to rule exercise out as playing any role whatsoever in this incident.

 

[Nobby]

OK... it has to be said. "Computers Rot Your Brain"

Proof? Right here in this thread and the responses: a guy gets bent diving computers and you all are jumping on exercise and/or alcohol.

You computer users think that they make diving safer while ignoring the obvious fact that the two computers gave different information even while worn on the same wrist (and not only did they not agree with each other but both were wrong and the guy still gets bent.)

That dive computers can do lightening fast calculations (the mantra of many brain rotted computer users) means nothing... the numbers they have to work with and the algorithms they use are far to simplistic and incomplete.

Is that a technophobes opinion.. Dive computers (different makes and even same makes but different models have different algorithms - hence different readings. That's exactly why we are told to dive on the more conservative. And FYI the algorithm are calculated using US navy tables, and haldanean models, the bases of any dive table you, I or Jo Schmo have dived from for years. The account for the depths you dive at more accurately, monitoring your depth at intervals as little as every second....NOW I'll get off my soap box!

 

[jonnythan]

Is that a technophobes opinion.. Dive computers (different makes and even same makes but different models have different algorithms - hence different readings. That's exactly why we are told to dive on the more conservative. And FYI the algorithm are calculated using US navy tables, and haldanean models, the bases of any dive table you, I or Jo Schmo have dived from for years. The account for the depths you dive at more accurately, monitoring your depth at intervals as little as every second....NOW I'll get off my soap box!

Read post 32.... computers only know your depth and time. *YOU* know a lot more that's relevant..

 

[Nobby]

Uh, that it was two days before.

I think it's safe to rule exercise out as playing any role whatsoever in this incident.

Exactly....Read the statement and you'll find that I said DAN advises against exercising immediately before and after a dive as this increases the chance of DCS.....your exercise was 2 days before and so probably is irrelevant.

 

[Nobby]

Read post 32.... computers only know your depth and time. *YOU* know a lot more that's relevant..

Yes I totally agree but my response was to Pug who was saying that it was the computers fault. Unless you're an android and have an inbuilt capacity for determining homeostatic levels due to external influences. In which case you should be known as Steve Austin!

 

[jonnythan]

Exactly....Read the statement and you'll find that I said DAN advises against exercising immediately before and after a dive as this increases the chance of DCS.....your exercise was 2 days before and so probably is irrelevant. Back in your box!

Then why did you title it "Like your exercise? Ever been bent? Read this"?

As for getting back in my box.... there is no need to insult me. I have done nothing of the sort to you. Kindly refrain from this type of talk

 

[jonnythan]

Yes I totally agree but my response was to Pug who was saying that it was the computers fault. Unless you're an android and have an inbuilt capacity for determining homeostatic levels due to external influences. In which case you should be known as Steve Austin!

I think the issue is computers have a way of making you trust those numbers because they seem so scientific and accurate.... they 'rot your brain' and make you pay closer attention to those numbers than to other more important things..

 

[Nobby]

Exactly....Read the statement and you'll find that I said DAN advises against exercising immediately before and after a dive as this increases the chance of DCS.....your exercise was 2 days before and so probably is irrelevant. Back in your box!

No you are right... Maybe I should have just left out the statement from Tim and then you all would know that it was simply information. I wasn't saying that the only reason that Tim got bent was due to exercise. I thought that I had made this clear on several occassions by stating that it was for information.

As for my comment, yes you are right I shouldn't use language like that, but as for not insulting me, just flick back across the way you have worded your response it was a little condescending.

Remember attack is the best form of defence. I'll be more careful in future!

 

[Uncle Pug]

Is that a technophobes opinion

Not at all Nobby. I'm just aware of the inadequacies of dive computers and how they lull divers into stuporously following their advice.

There is a much better way that yields much longer total dive times with plenty of conservatism as well. It isn't hard but it does require taking control of your dive away from a computer and managing it yourself.

Still...most folks would rather let their dive computer do the thinking for them. I just don't find that particularly wise but it certainly has been helpful to the dive industry as a profit point.