23 lb vs. 32 lb lift

[greenblayza]

Looking at the HOG 23lb doughnut and have heard many a great things. I dive tropical water and will be diving mainly rec as a DM and then Instructor, but plan to get into tech when the time is right - aka ASAP.

After looking around, haven't really been able to figure out which pound lift to go with. What's in a lift number? Give me a sense of what that is...Sorry, bad Charlie Rose impression...

Anyway - can someone tell me the difference between 23 lb and 32 lb lifts - or even 40 lb, etc.

 

[rhwestfall]

I use the 32 here (cold water of the Great Lakes) for single tank diving with bulky undergarments & steel tanks (single HP120's), as well as 7mm suites and AL 80's. Weighting is usually 6# of plate, and 12#-24# of lead depending on exposure suit and tank selection...

 

[CT Sean]

Assuming single tanks and thin wetsuits, 23 is likely more than enough. This is my semi-standard response to "what lift":

The standard answer is the wing has to do two things: 1. Compensate for the buoyancy change of suit compression and gas use and 2. float your rig without you in it - should you ever need to remove it for some reason.
There's a wing calculator link in the sticky at the top of this subforum , http://www.scubaboard.com/forums/bu...imate-wing-lift-calculator-2.html#post5736421 that helps determine lift requirements based on gear configuration

 

[Jim Lapenta]

Answered your PM on this. Sorry it took me til this afternoon to do that. IMO the 23 ( and I dive both of them) is fine for warm water, al or small steel tanks like lp 72's, where you need little extra weight. The difference in actual profile of the two is small. The 32 really is a compact wing in it's own right and the one I most often use. Especially with steel tanks, dry suit and the extra lead that requires.

A 32 is the most versatile singles wing for everything from tropical diving to dry dives under the ice. The 23 is better suited for travel and warm water with al tanks. Mine now sees more pool use than anything where all I'm in is a polar fleece or 1.5 mil and using maybe 4 lbs with an al tank and plate. The 32 goes everywhere and I never worry if I'm cutting it close on lift. Even with LP95 singles, a can light, reels, and maybe a slung bottle up to an al80.

As for smaller wings in general, my student for this weekend has a freedom plate, was using an LP95, and a HOG singles set up. Diving dry he also had a 4lb STA. His oxycheq 20 something wing would not float the rig. It sunk fully inflated. A 32? Would not have happened. It would have floated it nicely.

I'll be using my 32 with my new Freedom Contour Plate this weekend.

 

[TSandM]

Wings are made in different lift sizes because different diving conditions present different issues. If you are diving in warm water, with a 3 mil wetsuit and minimal lead, you require very little lift. Your suit can't lose much, because it didn't have much to begin with, and your rig won't be very negative, because even if you have all your ballast on it, there isn't much ballast there.

In contrast, in Puget Sound, I dive with 31 pounds of total ballast, with 11 pounds of it on the rig, and 20 on my waist. I dive a dry suit with 28 pounds of lift, most of which I could lose if I have a complete suit flood. (Not to mention that, when I made it to the surface, I'd be trying to lift sodden undergarments high enough to keep my chin out of the water!) My 32 pound wing might actually be marginal, if my dry suit were unable to hold any air at all (but it takes quite a bit of damage to achieve that).

The advantage to using the smallest wing you need is that a) you have very little drag, and b) because the material of the wing doesn't "taco" up around the tank, you don't have to work very hard to get air from the tops of the pontoons to the places where you can dump it. A properly sized wing is a delight to dive, and an oversized one can be a PITA.

 

[Griffo]

So the HOG 23# wing is my travel wing. Perfect for tropical diving. As I use it with an Ali plate, I use about 4-5# on the camband and no other weight. With a shortie it's got heaps of lift, even with a big can light and a stage.

I also have the hog 32 for home diving where I'm either in a 7mm semi or dry suit.

If you are going to go tech though, you will also need a doubles wing or go side mount so that's not really that valid for this decision.


Replied using Tapatalk. Please forgive my typing.

 

[greenblayza]

Hey folks,

Thanks for the responses. I guess I'm a little surprised that there isn't more information out there about finding the right lift for you - maybe I'm not looking in the right places.

Jim, I sent you a message, thanks for responding here as well.

CT, I had a quick look at the calculator and it looks pretty detailed. Thanks for pointing that out!

I guess I didn't mention that I would be diving tropical water with a ss back plate. Also, I'll be traveling around from time to time - S.E. Asia in the foreseeable future then to other parts of the world - so while it's counter intuitive to have a steel backplate, it sounds like the 23lb is better for travel...? (If I stay tropical.)

 

[bbarnett51]

I don't have the experience that these guys do so I'm not going to make a recommendation. However the HOG 32lb is pretty dang compact. I just got one and it's very nice.

 

[ams511]

The advantage to using the smallest wing you need is that a) you have very little drag, and b) because the material of the wing doesn't "taco" up around the tank, you don't have to work very hard to get air from the tops of the pontoons to the places where you can dump it.

I do not agree with this 100%. This advice may have been true in the early days wings but it is not true now. Tacoing is when the wing wraps around the tank and is a problem with wider wings. Most modern single tank wings have a narrow profile and the larger capacity wings are only a bit wider with most of the increase in capacity coming from the length, so tacoing won't be a problem and the increase in drag negligible.

A properly sized wing is a delight to dive, and an oversized one can be a PITA.

If a higher capacity wing in properly-sized for a cold water diver (30 lb or 40 lb) then why would it be a PITA if taken to the tropics? It would still dump the way it did in the cold water.

---------- Post added May 24th, 2013 at 07:19 PM ----------

I don't have the experience that these guys do so I'm not going to make a recommendation. However the HOG 32lb is pretty dang compact. I just got one and it's very nice.

For a good all around wing 30-35 is the sweet spot.

 

[TSandM]

When you dive a large wing in the tropics, you will have so little air in it that all the air goes to the highest point of the side pontoons, which means it's a long way from either the inflator or the butt dump. It's not a deal-breaker; you will just have to use more body English to get the air to where you want it to dump.

I have dived a 32 pound horseshoe wing in the tropics, and it's fine -- totally usable. But the 17 lb wing I have for true tropical gear setups is one sweet piece of gear. You hardly even have to think about venting, it's so easy.

Using the smallest wing that works is a joy. Using a somewhat larger wing can be quite manageable. Using a ridiculously oversized wing (eg. 60 lb lift for a single tank) makes venting a major pain. An experienced diver can make any of it work; a novice, with less insight into how to get things done, will have more trouble.