Aluminum 80s versus larger steel tanks

[Skittl1321]

Exactly. This was the 2nd point I made long ago as to the generic question for the real reason 'why wouldn't you want more air? As I said, if you had the choice between the two tanks with no additional costs the Al 80 would go extinct. Almost 200 posts later everybody is slowly coming around and saying exactly what I said a week ago.

But as pointed out like 200 posts ago, that free air doesn't exist.

I don't think anyone has argued more air is bad. Most people are argueing that the 80s are plenty sufficient for the type of diving they do in Cozumel. Not everyone wants a 2 hour dive; 1 hour is plenty. If you gave me a 120, I'd probably be thumbing the dive out of claustrophobia before I ran my air down. There is a point where it becomes uncomfortable to think about the fact that I'm still underwater.

 

[Mike]

Also--and I suspect this has been discussed--isn't a steel 120 generally a few pounds heavier topside than an aluminum 80? I realize the weight-in-air difference is small and that the characteristics we logically should find important relate to buoyancy in water (in which a steel tank excels), but some petite types may prefer to deal with the familiar, easy-to-handle aluminum 80.

High pressure 100

 

[Skittl1321]

Just wondering- do ops who use HP tanks charge less to those who get 95s/100s instead of 120s?

 

[mikeycanuk]

????

Now a longer dive =bad? I could see that up at our local check out pond but is Cozumel diving so bad that after an hour it's time to get up and out?

We aren't hardcore divers, 2 tank morning is about it 99% of the time so the longer my dive the more I get to see for my time and $. The only issue I had with the longer dives was...warming up my wetsuit...one can only hold it for so long.

 

[redacted]

????

Now a longer dive =bad? I could see that up at our local check out pond but is Cozumel diving so bad that after an hour it's time to get up and out?

We aren't hardcore divers, 2 tank morning is about it 99% of the time so the longer my dive the more I get to see for my time and $. The only issue I had with the longer dives was...warming up my wetsuit...one can only hold it for so long.

Another way to spoil a good dive. You know, letting go helps you descend.

 

[Skittl1321]

????

Now a longer dive =bad? I could see that up at our local check out pond but is Cozumel diving so bad that after an hour it's time to get up and out?

Well maybe not for you. But you aren't everybody are you. Some people get cold, some people get anxious.
I'm fine with an hour, really no problems, but I know I was getting antsy at Columbia Shallows when I was nearing 80 minutes. Just with the idea that I was still underwater. I'd certainly give it a try (you know, when that free air appears), but 120 minutes sounds way too long to me. I'd much rather do 3-4 shorter dives than 2 longer ones. But 2 dives are just fine with me.

I'm not sure I've ever made more than 30 minutes locally- the freezing and boring just gets to you.

I don't understand why you find it so hard to believe people have different preferences. I doubt anyone will turn away free air, but they also may not really need it. You like steel 120s, and it is great there is an op out there that provides that for you. Not everyone needs that.

 

[Lorenzoid]

Skittl, if you dive a conservative computer like I do, you'd get no more than an hour or so no matter how big your tank. I've had a similar discussion with Mike before with regard to whether my dive time is "too" limited by my computer. Mike just likes really long dives--he wants a lot of air and a liberal computer. Some people seek that, and others don't.

 

[fishi]

I wouldn't turn down the "extra air" if it were free, either, but the point is I believe I don't truly NEED the extra air for the kind of diving I want to do in Cozumel. As I said many posts above, after an hour in the water my wife and I are more than ready to get out and into some sunshine, sip some water, etc. There is always another dive. This is our vacation, not a dive marathon. And the need for an air reserve for contingencies seems marginal to me in drift diving.

Also--and I suspect this has been discussed--isn't a steel 120 generally a few pounds heavier topside than an aluminum 80? I realize the weight-in-air difference is small and that the characteristics we logically should find important relate to buoyancy in water (in which a steel tank excels), but some petite types may prefer to deal with the familiar, easy-to-handle aluminum 80. As I recall someone commenting, if more is better, then why not then push doubles on everyone? One answer is that out of water they are difficult on one's back, especially for people of slighter build or with back problems. Many of us visit Cozumel to enjoy relaxed, tropical vacation diving, not to do the kind of diving they do in, say, the Pacific Northwest. Heck, I can imagine feeling too lazy in Cozumel to even want to adjust my cam bands to accommodate a different sized tank.

You don't have to adjust the cam bands to switch to a HP120. The diameter is the same as a AL80, but it is 2 inches taller and a hell of a lot heavier.
I like having the extra air, But you do feel the weight underwater. Like Christi said it has a tendency to roll you. Because it's taller you can feel it sit on your butt and that's not very comfortable ether. I like having the extra air, but it comes at a price. If you don't need the extra air then there isn't any reason to drag around a large steel tank, above water or below water.

 

[Skittl1321]

Skittl, if you dive a conservative computer like I do, you'd get no more than an hour or so no matter how big your tank. I've had a similar discussion with Mike before with regard to whether my dive time is "too" limited by my computer. Mike just likes really long dives--he wants a lot of air and a liberal computer. Some people seek that, and others don't.

I do dive a conservative computer, and I do it on purpose (though for a different issue, not the anxiety/claustrophobia). My rental gear had a different computer on it, and I noticed at one point that computer was giving me 25+ minutes when mine was down to 6. Of course, moving up a 10 feet gave me plenty more time.
My NDLs haven't limited me yet, but I can see with just a bit more experience NDLs will be the limit, not air.

Right now though, money is the main reason I won't dive with an op that has the bigger tanks. I'm not sure how much time the NDL issue would become limiting.

 

[Mike]

I know I was getting antsy at Columbia Shallows when I was nearing 80 minutes. Just with the idea that I was still underwater.

Been there. Not for the reason of anxiety, but just getting a bit bored.

One thing this is cool that becomes maybe more apparent the longer you dive is seeing a different version of the same old dive site. High pressure tanks are not just about longer bottom times, they also come with an increased freedom. Aldora will take you on them on dives you won't see typically on an 80. Devils throat is a good example because it is a completely different dive/dive site when you dive with them on the big tanks. It's not just in and out and over with, you've got more freedom to extend the dive and see more parts of the reef on that dive with them. They will do dive sites differently, starting on one reef, jumping over to another part, running from one reef to the next because you've got a totally different bottom time and can do things differently. For people like me who are always looking over the next hill to see what's there, that's a lot of fun.