Deaths at Eagles Nest - Homosassa FL

[TracyN]

Wow! OW divers stay out of caves. Even if you think you can go in them, stay out. Read this OW divers, stay out of the caves until you're trained! There is nothing in them that you need to see until you receive training

 

[flots am]

As long as Training Agencies allow Open Water training in confined water this will continue. And I do understand the problem with land locked shops with only the local quarry available.

Not sure what you mean. "Confined water" in OW class refers to something pool-like (with sides and a bottom) not an overhead.

OW training is prohibited anywhere that a direct ascent to the surface isn't possible.

 

[DivemasterDennis]

What robetarak said. First, sadness, and grief and condolences to the family, but then there is a little anger in me too for the irresponsibility and unnecessary tragedy that occurred when a diver and non-diver exceeded by a big range, their safe limits. Condolences to the family and friends of the deceased.
DivemasterDennis

 

[HIGHwing]

Highwing,
I agree with your statement with the exception of I don't believe Eagles Nest is one of the sites OW instructors use. Back in the 80's Peacock and Orange Groove were used almost every weekend by local and out of state dive shops. I remember one tragedy where a group, five I believe, had graduated OW and were doing an advanced course. They had come down Friday for a Saturday class, gotten a hold of a local dive map and decided Royal Springs would be fun. They all died. As long as Training Agencies allow Open Water training in confined water this will continue. And I do understand the problem with land locked shops with only the local quarry available.

We all interpret things differently. Sometimes we read for permission when we're seeking permission. But there's this tidbit on the web: Eagle's Nest And there are definetly OW Classes (taught by someone) going on in the Nest. I recognize there are multiple issues going on here, and I fully understand the ownership of the land, and equal right and access. I also understand the Cave Community feels a responsibility to prevent this from happening (somehow) as a means to keep these sites open. I think this accident might create a very interesting basis for an article. I think the many sides (arguments?) about open access are all valid, but the problem is people feel entitled. And unfortuately, here we have two people conducting a dive that really requires training and expertise that isn't even offered by several popular training agencies to be successful. Now I realize back in the early days that cave was explored with primitive gear and understanding, but that is not the modern understanding of how to approach that dive.

Eagle's Nest could easily burn an unsuspecting diver. Can you imagine looking left and right and seeing only dark water, then you look up and don't see the exit? Scary thoughts. Add narcosis, add lack of training, add improper equipment, and lack of protocol, add cripling fear, add heavy breathing in panic, add family stress.

Not sure what you mean. "Confined water" in OW class refers to something pool-like (with sides and a bottom) not an overhead.

OW training is prohibited anywhere that a direct ascent to the surface isn't possible.

Agreed, but OW training is absolutely possible. There is a basin atop the cave entrance. Imagine the site is shaped quite like an hour glass where the top half of the hour glass is the basin, there is a restriction almost straight down leading to the bottom of the hour glass (huge cave and deep water). So as long as you keep your students in the basin, above 60 feet, and not allow them to pass through the restriction, you'll be able to meet the requirements as you've pointed out.

 

[lv2dive]

So we are even more clear... according to news sources, father was OW certified, son was not certified. They were testing gear received for Christmas.


http://www.baynews9.com/content/new...icles/bn9/2013/12/25/missing_divers_found.htm

Officials: Divers trying equipment before accident l Hernando County

---------- Post added December 26th, 2013 at 11:53 AM ----------

The sign ON LAND at the parking area (which is impossible to miss) states, in all caps, "Cave diving in this area is extremely dangerous - even life threatening! Do not dive unless you are a certified cave diver!!"





(PS what is the deal with the addition of "WebRep, currentVote, noRating, noWeight," etc. at the end of every post after I save it? ARGH)

 

[kwinter]

but then there is a little anger in me too for the irresponsibility and unnecessary tragedy that occurred when a diver and non-diver exceeded by a big range, their safe limits.

Sorry to disagree, Dennis, but it is not a little anger. I have an incredible amount of anger at this. The shortsightedness of this father and son to go where they did just to try out their new toys at a place they didn't belong and weren't trained for left plenty of survivors with horrible memories that will last the rest of their lives. They have ruined every future Christmas for their surviving family members, who will not be able to avoid thinking of Christmas as the day they lost their loved ones. Even worse, they have also given bad memories to the guys who gave up their Christmas night with their own families to go to EN and recover their bodies. Those guys deserve a huge amount of thanks, and I can only hope they are able to put the memory behind them and not have every future Christmas dig it up again.

Ken

 

[MalibuJerry]

It is a tragedy for the family of the two and difficult for those whose task it was to do the body recoveries. Many thanks to the recovery team. The issue of OW training there is not that it is out of spec, it is that there is the suggestion that this is confined water and therefore safe for the neophyte. Even if the sign is there and the instructor says something, the fact that he took his class to such a place is an implicit indication that it is a safe diving spot for newbies. Using a pool or a calm protected ocean inlet leaves quite a different impression. So, I would think that the dive shops and the dive instructors who use the open zone of caves as a confined water location cannot avoid at least moral responsibility for OW divers going into caves. Is the issue that there are no swimming pools in this part of Florida? really!

 

[flots am]

Agreed, but OW training is absolutely possible. There is a basin atop the cave entrance. Imagine the site is shaped quite like an hour glass where the top half of the hour glass is the basin, there is a restriction almost straight down leading to the bottom of the hour glass (huge cave and deep water). So as long as you keep your students in the basin, above 60 feet, and not allow them to pass through the restriction, you'll be able to meet the requirements as you've pointed out.

There's no way that water with a hole in the bottom that leads into an overhead is appropriate for OW class. I don't have the patience to go through all the standards, but I beleive a hard bottom is a requirement, and a "hard bottom with a hole" wouldn't qualify.

 

[Slamfire]

...Agreed, but OW training is absolutely possible. There is a basin atop the cave entrance. Imagine the site is shaped quite like an hour glass where the top half of the hour glass is the basin, there is a restriction almost straight down leading to the bottom of the hour glass (huge cave and deep water). So as long as you keep your students in the basin, above 60 feet, and not allow them to pass through the restriction, you'll be able to meet the requirements as you've pointed out.

For those of us not familiar with this site at all, if an ow student fails to keep buoyancy, how easy is it for him/her to unwillingly fall through the restriction? Over here, in this part of the world, we have shore dive sites where you get into a 300ft + walls after taking just a couple of steps into the water. You don't take divers with minimal or no experience to these sites and hope they will be able to stop descent at 60 ft.

 

[beaverdivers]

So we are even more clear... according to news sources, father was OW certified, son was not certified. They were testing gear received for Christmas.


http://www.baynews9.com/content/new...icles/bn9/2013/12/25/missing_divers_found.htm

Officials: Divers trying equipment before accident l Hernando County

---------- Post added December 26th, 2013 at 11:53 AM ----------

The sign ON LAND at the parking area (which is impossible to miss) states, in all caps, "Cave diving in this area is extremely dangerous - even life threatening! Do not dive unless you are a certified cave diver!!"





(PS what is the deal with the addition of "WebRep, currentVote, noRating, noWeight," etc. at the end of every post after I save it? ARGH)

Unbelievable!