Your favorite certification agency ...

[spc751]

My experience so far is NASDS, SSI and PADI. I took NASDS in the early 80s then quit diving after a few years. About 20 years later I decided to take up diving again and phoned my shop which is now SSI. My original instructor was still there and issued me a SSI card to replace my NASDS card which was long gone. I wanted to take the ow class and he said I did not need to because I was a good diver. I took the course anyway and thought it was very short. I talked to my original instructor about it and he said that they sell a lot of specialty courses to give divers the knowledge that the NASDS ow course used to provide.

I have since taken several SSI and PADI courses and found some differences. I prefer PADI because the theory goes well beyond what is in the book, there are more required dives and the dives must be done with an instructor instead of just with a dive buddy. There are also skills that must be performed and passed with PADI courses. They also do not criticise other agencies to make themselves sound better.

I also find the hose routing on the SSI gear configuration is stupid (to me). I like the PADI setup more and the DIR most of all.

I have been thinking about taking UTD courses because I like the courses and the videos, however, I do not like them flogging “UTD” gear. What really turned me off was receiving an email about UTD cycling shorts. I am willing to wear a UTD T-shirt but I am not going to wear UTD shorts on my mountain bike! I have learned a few things from AG on some of his videos I just wish he would stick to training.

I like the way that GUE operates and think I will do Primer and Fundies but no further. I wish they did SM because I do not want to go BM. I have had several hernia operations and the weight of one tank on my back is all I can stand.

 

[drbill]

Los Angeles County

 

[MXGratefulDiver]

I'd say the YMCA, but it isn't around (certifying divers) anymore......

For recreational diving, as stated above, its the instructor and student that makes it a success. The agency only establishes the business plan...

The YScuba program morphed into SEI ...

... Bob (Grateful Diver)

 

[freewillie]

I chose PADI not for any grand aspirations of training ideals but for the practical reason most recreational dive shops for vacation diving are associated with PADI. I went to just about every dive shop in a 20 mile radius before choosing my current LDS. They happen to be PADI and chose them more because a friend who also dives highly recommended a specific instructor. After certifying I also think he was excellent, so much so he has trained my daughter for AOW.

As for set standards, when my daughter did her basic OW it was with a PADI shop at the resort we stayed at on vacation. She was able to certify there on an accelerated schedule, but the text book and test were the exact same ones I had for certification. And just because we were on vacation didn't mean they just passed her to pass her and collect the money. She had to go back and do extra skills in the pool before she was allowed to get to the next level and took one of her tests over after not passing the first time.

My nephew is SSI certified and rents gear at my PADI LDS. He goes on the same dive boats and although not PADI doesn't prevent him from diving either. It's just not as familiar as even NAUI but still an adequate certification.

 

[TSandM]

I think, when one is answering this question, that it is EXTREMELY important to think about what an agency is and what it does. Comments like this one:

I also tire of the obligatory "take a GUE class" interjections into every single question anyone ever posts about what class they should take. The truth is that even GUE has had bad instructors ... and GUE is not a good fit for everyone's diving needs or preferences.

confuse the role of agency and instructor. Agencies design curricula and set standards. They set prerequisites for classes, and in particular they define the prerequisites and the certification process for instructors. They set QA requirements and monitor QA reports. Agencies don't teach classes, and I'm not even sure that you can say that agencies certify instructors -- that's kind of borderline, because agencies do authorize the personnel who teach instructor classes. Agencies also do paperwork and issue cards.

You can like an agency's process despite disliking one of their instructors. You can like the way the curriculum is designed even if you've had a bad class. I am the last person to say that all GUE class experiences are great, or that all GUE instructors are fabulous or work for everybody. But I listed the things I like about the AGENCY (forgetting two big ones, which are recency/recertification requirements, and 100% QA) and I think those things are true regardless of whether there are rocky spots in the implementation.

 

[CAPTAIN SINBAD]

Great responses but just to clarify, this thread was meant to compare curriculum and training standards as written by one agency against those developed by another. We are not talking about whether PADI instructors are better than PSAI instructors or vice versa. In terms of how the curriculum is laid out and how it is meant to be taught, do certain agencies make more sense that others? It would also be good to hear from instructors if their preference for an agency is influenced by factors that may not be training related. SSI may have laid out their courses and procedures really well but since they do not allow independent instructors, a lot of instructors may not like them etc. Thanks.

 

[MXGratefulDiver]

I think, when one is answering this question, that it is EXTREMELY important to think about what an agency is and what it does. Comments like this one:

confuse the role of agency and instructor. Agencies design curricula and set standards. They set prerequisites for classes, and in particular they define the prerequisites and the certification process for instructors. They set QA requirements and monitor QA reports. Agencies don't teach classes, and I'm not even sure that you can say that agencies certify instructors -- that's kind of borderline, because agencies do authorize the personnel who teach instructor classes. Agencies also do paperwork and issue cards.

You can like an agency's process despite disliking one of their instructors. You can like the way the curriculum is designed even if you've had a bad class. I am the last person to say that all GUE class experiences are great, or that all GUE instructors are fabulous or work for everybody. But I listed the things I like about the AGENCY (forgetting two big ones, which are recency/recertification requirements, and 100% QA) and I think those things are true regardless of whether there are rocky spots in the implementation.

I'm not the least bit confused ... and given that I'm the person who initially turned you on to GUE, I'm surprised to hear you say otherwise. My point is that "take a GUE class" isn't the answer to every question.

Recently there was a thread asking about the difference between NAUI Master Diver and Divemaster. The OP didn't ask what class he should be taking ... he asked for specific information about two specific classes. And yet the inevitable "take a GUE class" was quickly offered.

Yesterday someone else asked if you could use a BSAC certification as a prerequisite for a PADI class. Within a very few responses someone offered "take a GUE class". Once again, it was a completely unrelated answer to the question.

I get that they're great classes. But when someone asks about specific classes by some other agency, the GUE folks in here need to learn to let someone who knows about the program being asked about answer the question.

Not everybody wants to or needs to take a GUE class ... and the incessant overselling gets tiresome ... even to someone like me who's inclined to recommend GUE classes to people who would be a good fit for that style of diving ...

... Bob (Grateful Diver)

---------- Post added December 18th, 2013 at 02:51 PM ----------

Great responses but just to clarify, this thread was meant to compare curriculum and training standards as written by one agency against those developed by another. We are not talking about whether PADI instructors are better than PSAI instructors or vice versa. In terms of how the curriculum is laid out and how it is meant to be taught, do certain agencies make more sense that others? It would also be good to hear from instructors if their preference for an agency is influenced by factors that may not be training related. SSI may have laid out their courses and procedures really well but since they do not allow independent instructors, a lot of instructors may not like them etc. Thanks.

I wonder if the agency comparison that Walter put together years ago is still available on ScubaBoard ... I think initially it was posted in an online magazine or something, and I wonder if the fallout from the PADI lawsuit caused them to remove it.

Anybody know?

... Bob (Grateful Diver)

 

[mmadiver]

I did some diving with an ex SEAL in the Philippines. He was trained to go down and disarm nukes that had gone down on a ship or plane etc. He was definitely comfortable in the water but by Scubaboard standards of perfect trim, low air consumption, not touching anything etc....he sucked....of course, I probably do too. Great guy though.

Ha, this made me laugh

 

[TSandM]

Bob -- The OP asked what AGENCY do you like best.

I don't think the answer to every question is "take a GUE class". But he asked about how an agency runs itself, and you answered about classes and instructors. I wanted to get the discussion back to what an AGENCY does. I listed a number of specific, objective things that GUE does that I think are laudable. Do you have an objection to any of the things I posted?

 

[Centrals]

Great responses but just to clarify, this thread was meant to compare curriculum and training standards as written by one agency against those developed by another.....

The comparision is only valid if the diver is completing the same course offer by different agency.

---------- Post added December 19th, 2013 at 02:39 PM ----------

...Not everybody wants to or needs to take a GUE class ... and the incessant overselling gets tiresome ... even to someone like me who's inclined to recommend GUE classes to people who would be a good fit for that style of diving ...
... Bob (Grateful Diver)

Everyone will be in black, low volume mask, dry suit, Al tank etc etc.
I do drink beer besides tea.