New policy on lionfish in the park

[mjatkins]

I, for one, am happy to hear this news. I am on the list at the marine park office to take the course when it happens. There has always been a rule against taking knives into the park, and no one seems to have been offended by that. Now people are expecting to be allowed to take spears, and are upset when they are told that they are not allowed. The marine park seems to be formulating a strategy, and like that strategy or not, it is their responsibility to do so. It is our responsibility to live by those rules while diving in the park that they are there to protect.

Imho, divers (myself included) do need training on how to properly eliminate lionfish with spears etc. I expect that to do it responsibly, it will take buoyancy control that the average vacation diver simply does not posses. A large percentage of the people who show up on the boats here each day have no business carrying a camera, let alone a spear.

And for those who's vacation just wouldn't be the same unless they personally get to kill something, don't forget that you can still hunt to your hearts content outside the marine park. I'm sure that soon shops will offer northern trips to "the killing fields", just like there are to Cantarel or Baracuda.

 

[Karibelle]

How would this be "taking more money away from the divemasters"?

It's curious to me how some people are so upset by this, in many cases the same people who are advocating killing the lionfish in the first place. If what you want is dead lionfish, it seems to me that a program to do so that is sponsored by the marine park would be a good thing. I say "sponsored" because the article reads like the tools will be owned by the park and handed out to qualified people, not purchased. Time will tell how this plays out.

Many people appear upset because this program may simply end their vigilantism, while actually achieving their stated goal of killing the fish, which calls into question that goal in the first place. Do they really want the fish gone? or are they just unreasonably giddy about being able to kill things on the reef? And note that I'm skeptical about the ability to kill the fish with a spear while not touching a single other living thing on the reef. In the experiences I've had where a diver on a dive with me has speared fish, it is not accurate to say there was no collateral damage to the reef.

kari

 

[Texas Torpedo]

I, for one, am happy to hear this news. I am on the list at the marine park office to take the course when it happens. There has always been a rule against taking knives into the park, and no one seems to have been offended by that. Now people are expecting to be allowed to take spears, and are upset when they are told that they are not allowed. The marine park seems to be formulating a strategy, and like that strategy or not, it is their responsibility to do so. It is our responsibility to live by those rules while diving in the park that they are there to protect.

You are apparently missing the point altogether. This discussion is about the marine park requiring the use of a specific spear - one which is overpriced, and its effectiveness compared to other Hawaiian style spears in question. It is not about tourist divers spearing in the marine park.

I also find the opportunists at PADI and any other agency offering a lionfish cards to DM's who have been actively hunting lionfish in Cozumel quite humorous. DM's in Coz don't need or care about a cute little card, nor should they or anyone else have to fork over (or donate) a single penny for said "training".. It should be donated..

 

[gypsyjim]

I see nothing wrong with the actual tool, or the stated goal. It is the big brother attitude that suques.

Politicians very seldom take the time, or make the effort to understand the effects of rules they are so quick to make for any problem they fail to understand.
Sounds like the case with these new rules. Well intended tho they may be, they always have unintended consequences, that seem somehow to miraculously benefit a few well connected friends.

 

[Rodive]

This is a load of crap, it's program is not only putting money in hands that could care less about the lionfish but is taking more money away from the dive masters. This is a propaganda machine at work. Stop those that are getting them cause we arent making a buck! Crap. Lion fish killer-card, what a load. We killed 45 today.
I had La Hach cook some up for my wife and I. I didnt hit one thing that was alive (other than lionfish). Neither did the other divers with me. When they where sitting in the barrel sponge we chase them out and hit them as they crest the top. Simple, if your a quick enough shot.
There are a lot of very angry dms right now.

The propaganda machine will eat your babies and answer now!!Muahahahaha!!!
Just saying it is "a load of crap" without even understanding what is being proposed is being ignorant.
Also stating "Stop those that are getting them because we aren't making a buck" is completely the other way around. Just for your information ELF Tools are not being sold on the island because they were asked by the Coz Marine Park to not be sold here on March 19th 2010 because Ricardo did not want another lionfish hunting tool just floating around the island being sold by any distributer. They had the decency to first talk to the Marine Park and ask their permission to be sold. They are not making money on this, fool.
The guy that is selling at 20 bucks a pop and has inundated the market and has no regard for the local marine park laws is making money. But, that’s ok I guess he must be some ones friend.
Now regarding the 45 Lionfish you got yesterday, you should be proud! Just be aware that your hunt was against the law and I also expect before you cooked them up at the Hach you checked them for the parasite that some are beginning to present. All the ones you did find with this parasite you sent the samples to the correct facility. I am sure all your other proficient divers who hunted and DMs who hunted understand this, also. If you spew crap about what the Marine Park is trying to do to your DMs I am sure they will be angry if you try to inform yourself and then pass that knowledge down to your staff they may just get behind you.
I am not too good to keep learning and I am not to good to hear better ideas. When can we all meet so you can call us names and tell us how much of an idiot we are and hopefully we can try to explain our side of this program? I am on the island so is one of the owners of the ELF tool. Put a place a date and a time and I will have him go and I will love to go, also. Ah yes, and please bring your babies, the propaganda machine might get hungry.

Who can I send a picture of the parasites email so they can uplaod here I do not know how to upload...

 

[mjatkins]

You are apparently missing the point altogether. This discussion is about the marine park requiring the use of a specific spear - one which is overpriced, and its effectiveness compared to other Hawaiian style spears in question. It is not about tourist divers spearing in the marine park.

I also find the opportunists at PADI and any other agency offering a lionfish cards to DM's who have been actively hunting lionfish in Cozumel quite humorous. DM's in Coz don't need or care about a cute little card, nor should they or anyone else have to fork over (or donate) a single penny for said "training".. It should be donated..

I disagree that I am missing the point, but I suppose that is dependant on what you think the point is. Since the marine park will be paying for the tools, it seems only reasonable that they should get to decide what those tools will be. Let's give them the benefit of the doubt, that they have done some research and made an informed decision. It may not be the decision that everyone else would have made, but it was their decision to make. Let me restate that; it is THEIR decision to make.

Calling PADI opportunists in this regard implies that they sat down and developed a pointless program for the purpose of making money. I would say that like every other agency out there, they are a business, and as such are not "opportunists" for making money any more than you are for working for a living. It has also been clearly stated several times on this board that PADI did not develop this course. It was developed by an individual instructor, who then applied to PADI to sanction it. This is no different than any other distinctive specialty ie. the whale shark course, or the tec support diver course. If you want to call the instructor who developed it an opportunist, that is your prerogative.

And, you are correct that those of us who work as DMs in Cozumel don't need a "cute little card", but I would appreciate the training that comes with it. And, when I signed up for this course I didn't get the impression that it will cost me. I believe those little bracelets that we give you each day will be paying for the training and tools. I don't know that for a fact, but that is my belief.

 

[Rodive]

I see nothing wrong with the actual tool, or the stated goal. It is the big brother attitude that suques.

Politicians very seldom take the time, or make the effort to understand the effects of rules they are so quick to make for any problem they fail to understand.
Sounds like the case with these new rules. Well intended tho they may be, they always have unintended consequences, that seem somehow to miraculously benefit a few well connected friends.

This is a very reasonable comment. One of the main reasons Marine Pasrk has not stopped the practice of everyone going out and hunting until they have a proposed plan that they can put forth. They know what is going on and how things are being done. Nonetheless, they rather wait until thye are ready to introduce a reasonable program than to discredit well intentioned hunters.

 

[Karibelle]

I am not too good to keep learning and I am not to good to hear better ideas. When can we all meet so you can call us names and tell us how much of an idiot we are and hopefully we can try to explain our side of this program? I am on the island so is one of the owners of the ELF tool. Put a place a date and a time and I will have him go and I will love to go, also.

Sounds like you guys (Rodive and Firstdive2005) have a date tomorrow, at 9 p.m. at Senor Frogs. I hope you both attend, and that you both post about the discussion you will have!

kari

 

[Rodive]

Sounds like you guys (Rodive and Firstdive2005) have a date tomorrow, at 9 p.m. at Senor Frogs. I hope you both attend, and that you both post about the discussion you will have!

kari

Love it! Just so everyone knows we will be doing this event both the 12th and next saturday the 18th. When we originally planned this we completely misjudged the fact that people will be spent due to Carnaval and the end of the quincena. But the 18th most people will be ready to PARTY again so we hope by opening the date of the 18th also we may get some more people to participate!

 

[mjatkins]

Love it! Just so everyone knows we will be doing this event both the 12th and next saturday the 18th. When we originally planned this we completely misjudged the fact that people will be spent due to Carnaval and the end of the quincena. But the 18th most people will be ready to PARTY again so we hope by opening the date of the 18th also we may get some more people to participate!

I'll be there. Looking forward to meeting you and learning a bit more about what is going to happen.