Yet, another ? about tying off the SPG and primary?

[rjack321]

Thanks DIR atlanta for the 'history' lesson. I was never clear how I ended up on the stroke side of the light cord issue, but now I know.

I also know that I have to do things the 'cave' way down in MX in Dec

 

[reubencahn]

Fundamentally, this boils down to an "open water" vs "cave" issue.

In cave diving, we are constantly clipping off the light head to fiddle with stage bottles, run reels, etc. As someone else pointed out, if the light cord is under the long hose, then when you clip it off, the long hose will be "captured", making it more difficult to deploy. A stage bottle drop or pickup is one of the most vulnerable points during a dive where a temporary OOG situation can occur. If you had to donate gas at exactly that instance, then there is no "potential" about it - it will be a cluster.

So in cave diving, it makes the most sense to have the cord go over the long hose. Get the OOG diver his gas, and then figure out where to go from there.

In OW diving, you typically don't do as much clipping with the light head, so the feeling was that leaving the light in the donating diver's hand (with the hose over the cord), would be the most effective way to handle an OOG situation. That way the light could be used for signalling, etc. Once the OOG diver is plugged in, the long hose can be deployed, and then the team makes for the surface.

For a time, I think GUE was actually teaching it both ways - "cord under" in the Tech courses, "cord over" in the Cave courses. Eventually, I guess they decided that it didn't make sense to have two procedures, so they officially settled on the "Cave" method.

At least that was the way I heard it.

Of course, if you have to deploy at some other time, you have to then get the cord out of the way to fully deploy--or maybe the lighthead gets yanked and dropped and possibly tangled in the long hose. On the other hand, if your muscle memory is trained to always pass the light cord back under before clipping, you would never trap the long hose. As I said, a potential for things going pear shaped either way. I guess it comes down to an evaluation of the relative likelihood that either method will lead to a CF. So your explanation that this is really a cave vs. tech dichotomy makes sense--at least to this non-cave diver.

 

[limeyx]

Thanks DIR atlanta for the 'history' lesson. I was never clear how I ended up on the stroke side of the light cord issue, but now I know.

I also know that I have to do things the 'cave' way down in MX in Dec

STROKE!

 

[rjack321]

Yup, that's me. I've been trying it out the outside and I have more issues passing the lighthead over after donating than just remembering to always go under in the first place.

Oi, of all the things in life.

 

[SparticleBrane]

Is it just me or is this debate ridiculous?

 

[limeyx]

Is it just me or is this debate ridiculous?

STROKE! (Yeah, it's pretty much done I think)

 

[DIR-Atlanta]

Of course, if you have to deploy at some other time, you have to then get the cord out of the way to fully deploy

It's actually not that hard to do if you practice it that way. Plug in the OOG diver, check OK, and then use the right hand to slip the light head off the left hand, pass it around the hose, and then back onto the left hand. The motion is very smooth, and only takes about half a second. Then you deploy the long hose if necessary.

On the other hand, if your muscle memory is trained to always pass the light cord back under before clipping, you would never trap the long hose.

I might reasonably have to do that 5-10 times during any given cave dive, but have never had to donate gas (knock on wood). It seems to me that the "cord over" approach is the least overall hassle, based on my training and the type of diving I do. I believe that the ability to donate gas cleanly with the lighthead clipped off overrides the slight inconvenience of having to transfer the lighthead from one hand to another when sharing gas during other parts of the dive (including the S-drill).

The other concern is primary light failure (which I have had to happen). If the light fails and needs to be clipped off permanently, then with the "cord under" configuration, you would have to pass it behind the (undeployed) long hose to get it positioned properly for the exit. The reason, of course, is that you might still have to donate gas in that situation, so an unencumbered long hose is a critical consideration.

I guess it comes down to an evaluation of the relative likelihood that either method will lead to a CF. So your explanation that this is really a cave vs. tech dichotomy makes sense--at least to this non-cave diver.

Thanks - every once in a while I got something right (i.e. "Even a blind mouse occasionally finds some cheese" )

 

[DIR-Atlanta]

Is it just me or is this debate ridiculous?

Actually, I don't think it is.

Donating gas to a diver is probably the one situation where it matters most that you "Do It Right". Having the procedure and mechanics completely dialed in might make the difference between handling a situation well and a body recovery (or perhaps two, since cave diving fatalities often come in pairs). I've never had a "true" OOG emergency in a cave, but between the practice and the "thinking it through", I am confident that I could deal with it properly if it ever occurred. And that definitely makes me (and my buddies) a lot more comfortable when we dive together.

 

[SparticleBrane]

I was speaking more of the "cave line vs. zip ties" debate. I should have clarified; my apologies.

 

[Robert Phillips]

I don't need bulletproof. Bullet resistant is just fine.

---
Ken

You are going to die!