Will Air Integration in dive computers replace the SPG?

[CuzzA]

I have a question for DiveNav and others... Lets move the bar a little bit.

How difficult would it be to incorporate CO and O2 analyzing into the AI? Would that not provide some real value to AI other than just tank pressure and consumption data?

 

[Wookie]

I have a question for DiveNav and others... Lets move the bar a little bit.

How difficult would it be to incorporate CO and O2 analyzing into the AI? Would that not provide some real value to AI other than just tank pressure and consumption data?

Now you're talking rebreather. The O2 tech is there, the CO is not. Not directly real time anyway.

 

[tbone1004]

way too much of a power suck and the transmitters would have to be enormous to fit the o2 and CO analyzers in there as well as a way to reduce the pressure and flow over the sensors and would also be fairly complicated to seal properly. The sensors also need gas flowing over them to register properly so it would not be very meaningful because there is no way to purge the system from the ambient gas with the high pressure gas coming into it. Add to that a $100+/year maintenance cost to replace the O2 sensor every year for each tank and it provides no benefit from something like the cootwo. Once the gas is in there, it isn't going to change, and the cootwo is cheap enough to only want one.

 

[Lorenzoid]

Old threads on SPG reliability (and SPG v. AI transmitter) for those interested:

http://www.scubaboard.com/forums/co...d-analyzers/188492-spg-failure-frequency.html

http://www.scubaboard.com/forums/ba...-has-higher-rate-failure-spg-transmitter.html

 

[Diving Dubai]

If I may chime in.

Yes I'm an AI owner, as is my wife. We have 3 transmitters (TX) each. So far I we've had over 100 dives each on our comps since we upgraded to them in Jan 15.

So far not one loss of signal, in fact we've found the TX to have a greater range than published

Once I paired my wife's comp to my TX on my rig. Not technologies fault user error with lack of coffee.

We both retain our SPG (button gauges on or side slung tanks) Now I never look at the SPG during the dive, I use it on the surface when setting up the gear and by habit I chose to look at teh SPG when doing a pre jump reg breath rather than the computer - but that's just muscle memory rather than a conscious decision.

My TX are on short 6" hoses with QD couplings so they work on side slung tanks well and don't get damaged

On my Comp the management of the TX could be better - I give feed back to the manufacturer although I'm not connected in any way,I just dive mine a lot. Gas changing could be better, perhaps when it sees a flow on a different tank flash it up and you confirm rather than you having to select it, after you've gone through the protocols of ensuring you've got the correct reg and gas for your MOD.

TX batteries are a concern. personally I'd like to be able to recharge them, given I have a camera, lights iPad etc recharging not an issue.

Some points about failures (Wookie) I accept the risk BUT most kit failures are down to the individual not checking their kit rather than the kit (AI or not)

Just as DC were better then tables as they account for depth rather than just a square profile, then AI with gas consumption rates surely must improve things further.


Funny how AI gets a bad rep for too many failure points etc etc, yet people look up-to Re breather Divers as the pinnacle of diving, who's kit is so reliable that they take a complete redundant OC set (of all the gasses they need for that dive)with them. That's considered acceptable ?!? Yes I accept all their additional training etc I'm just being devils advocate. RB divers now go for HUD again no-one flames them for that choice?

Yes I'm sure some of the older AI units were troublesome, but not the newer, unfortunately some people won't let that drop.

I'm certain that soon all computers will have colour screens and the option of AI But equally I'd like that people are still taught the basics and then move to AI if they choose after weighing up the pro's and cons for their diving

I love my AI but I could dive without it, it just makes my diving easier/more enjoyable. But that's a personal opinion

 

[doctormike]

I have a question for DiveNav and others... Lets move the bar a little bit.

How difficult would it be to incorporate CO and O2 analyzing into the AI? Would that not provide some real value to AI other than just tank pressure and consumption data?

If you are diving open circuit, the O2 fraction doesn't change during the dive, so no need for real time monitoring - much better to leave that technology on the dive boat than to take it under water with you, right? Also, those sensors are delicate, affected by humidity, have limited shelf lives, need to be replaced at regular intervals. And if you are relying on them during the dive, like a CCR diver does, you usually have several and use voting logic to hopefully throw out the bad reading.

CO contamination is still very rare, I don't know anyone who routinely tests for that, maybe in very sketchy situations where you don't trust the compressor, etc...

So for OC, that sounds like a huge increase in cost and complexity for no real benefit.

 

[olphart]

Not steering and brakes! Unless you commute by jet...



Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Modern steering is electric.....

 

[doctormike]

Modern steering is electric.....

I'm no car expert, but as of 2013 there was one production car with steer by wire. Have they all switched in the past two years?

 

[Wookie]

I'm no car expert, but as of 2013 there was one production car with steer by wire. Have they all switched in the past two years?

And it likely isn't steer by wireless. Now, if there were a wired AI computer, I could get with that.

Imagine cranking the wheel over and the dashboard gives you an error code?

And just to add fun to it, my main engines are fly by wire. If you move the throttles faster than the servo moters can adjust the throttles, they blink and fail where they are. So if you're going hell bent for leather and you pull them back to full reverse, you get a blinkey light. But you are still going hell bent for leather.

 

[kelemvor]

CO contamination is still very rare, I don't know anyone who routinely tests for that, maybe in very sketchy situations where you don't trust the compressor, etc...

I guess you don't know me, and this post isn't going to change that but.. I test for CO most of the time. When my cootoo arrives that will become every time I dive nitrox by default. Hopefully combined analysis will become a thing that other manufacturers copy. I'm sure divenav disagrees, but it would be good for diving in my opinion.

I wouldn't mind having it somehow integrated so it would just be an afterthought. As others have mentioned existing sensors are pretty limiting. That's where scientists come in. VTT claims to have a microspectrometer that is tiny and can analyze gasses using the processor on a smartphone. The brief article even talks about how it works. I doubt any existing dive computers have processors anywhere near as powerful as a current generation smartphone, but who knows what the actual processing requirements are for analysis.