Why not DIR ?

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Snowbear:
What baggage is that, Doc?

Do you mean the mean-spirited Anti-DIR insults and bashing you see so frequently on ScubaBoard (and elsehwhere) whenever you mention the acronym?

Or is it the baggage of the connotations of the "Doing it Right" name given to the style of diving? After all, the many who don't care to take that line of training will automatically assume you think they are "doing it wrong" if they didn't take the class.

Oh, maybe it's the baggage of all the anti-DIR rants and defensiveness you get if you advocate the great training you got to others?

Acrually Snow,

I think that there is meanness on both sides of the DIR debate, but that's something we just don't allow here. Agency bashing just isn't allowed on ScubaBoard, whether it's PADI, NAUI, GUE or whomever. If anyone SEES this happening they should report the post and tell us WHY.

However, many feel that they only way to get great training is a Fundies course, and I happen to disagree. I don't need the "baggage" of trying to keep my gear conformed to someone else's standards. I don't need the baggage of having lots of options proscribed to me that I am fully capable of making myself. I also don't need the baggage of the controversey on either side of the corral. Whether it's the bombastic rantings of one of the founders and those who think it cool to sound like him, or people responding in kind to his words. It just has no way of improving the quality of my diving experience and that's why I don't ascribe to DIR.
 
Snowbear:
BTW - most of my dives there were buddiless :eek_2:

They're going to revoke your kool-aid.

I did a dive on saturday where two of my buddies were wearing doubles that had a single yoke connector on the manifold, j-valves and no octo. The DIR-concept of team was not terribly apparently, and the champagne bubbles on yoke o-ring connectors were flying due to lack of a pre-dive bubble check. Still when it came to moving around 2,500-lbs of rock as a team I think we did pretty good and didn't squash anyone which was more important on that dive than worrying about running out of gas in 20 feet of water. I think I solo'd on several occasions when shuttling around 55-gal plastic lift drums, too... Somehow I didn't panic when I found myself alone in 20 feet of water with only around 140 cubic feet of gas on my back and no DIR buddy...
 
Don Burke:
Here is a link to a page with the article itself and some follow up:

http://www.pina.us/dive/


thank you.... that's a great resource

this quote at the end of the article caught my eye:

"If its not Hogarthian, it's not right. If you're not doing it right,
don't do it at all."

this may be the kernel of DIR after all (back in 1995). basically,
DIR is another name for the Hogarthian system, tweaked and refined.

GUE was incorporated in 2000. so by that time i'm sure the DIR
name had had a chance to become entrenched:

http://www.sunbiz.org/scripts/corde...&r1=&r2=&r3=&r4=GLOBALUNDERWATEREXPLORERS&r5=
 
Stephan, why?
 
My ISP was down yesterday, so I missed a lot, but have caught up now.

Here's what I love . . .

I have been working with SCBA for WAY many more years han I've been working with SCUBA. I'm not sure what the short term exposure limit value for liquid H2O is, but I'm confident it's a lot higher than many of the things I've worked with since the mid-1980's. Self-rescue was a real issue then, there are more rules on this stuff now than there were 20 years ago, in terms of secondary backup, both personnel staffing when SCBA is required, and use of egress bottles. There are specialized contractors I've seen that use quintuple-redundant SCBA in the performance of their jobs, and fatalities still occur in their line of work (last one I know of was in 2002)

The concept of team can be learned elsewhere as well. I always enjoy it when my wife / dive buddy and I transfer to a new facility and we're put through firefighting training for the first time under a new fire chief. They wind up pretty impressed at how quickly we complete the exercise with a minimum of communication, and how much training powder is left in our extinguishers. This crosses over into our scuba hobby.

Yet, when I post my reasoning and philosophy, there are extrapolations that I've learned 'everything I need to know' from any one particular instructor/ agency, or my post is copied into a mythbusting exercise, and so on.

I have both led as well as contributed to incident investigations using two different standardized methodologies (Apollo and TapRoot), yet when I offer to use that for everyone's benefit if someone will supply quantifiable data associated with their assertion, the data never appears. The data doesn't change due to name calling - the data is what it is, impartial. The interpretation of the data however is often less than impartial (I remember when the lab rats were fed overdoses of TAB soda in the 1970's for example - cyclamates). Use of the standardized methodology assists in minimizing this though. I have a pretty good track record at dispassionately reviewing data (this is how I've outlasted many supervisors through reorganizations).

My main point is I don't limit what real life experience I have from outside of scuba training I choose to apply to the way I participate in scuba as a hobby. This definitely doesn't make me fit into any one easily labeled category, although it is somewhat amusing (and sometimes to a degree frustrating / insulting) to see how often it's performed and what permutations it takes as this goes along. Paradigms are definitely not limited to any one group! Having an open mind is independant of any scuba certifying agency.

I think my stake is at least up to medium, or near medium well, at this point in this thread (still feeling somewhat like Copernicus). I definitely have some things in common with Net Doc.

Time to knock off for supper.
 
matt_unique:
There is without question a certain protection for DIR divers on this board among some of the mods. Some DIR divers use much worse words to describe PADI or Solo divers for example and those posts remain without interference.

it's good to know that both sides feel the other side is being "protected" by
the Mods, and their own side isn't.

means we're treating both sides the same

:wink:
 
Stephen Ash:
Oh, I don't think so, Andy.


yeah dude... read the articles and think about it


onfloat:
Did you see the link I posted earlier in the thread about "before it was called DIR"? It was the Hogarthain system and stroke was even mentioned. It was written by Billy Williams. Here it is again.

http://www.cisatlantic.com/trimix/text/HOGARTH3.TXT


awesome! i had missed that, thank you

it really confirms my impression from George Irvine's 1995 article that
DIR is another name for an "updated" Hogarthian system. back in 1995,
there wasn't even a word for "DIR" yet... but there was the Hogarthian
system.

as the Hogarthian system was tweaked by the WKPP guys, it was renamed
DIR.

that's my theory, and i'm sticking to it

:wink:
 

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