Why ‘everyone is responsible for their own risk-based decisions’ isn’t the right approach to take

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I disagree. It has been researched under a controlled study and published with the conclusion that it is an effective method to reduce diver incidents.
Where is this study? Did I miss a reference to it earlier? Please trot it out for us. Linky linky. It's not that I don't believe it, but I don't.
as the owner of Scubaboard you carry a lot of weight,
Yeah. Sure. That and $22.50 will buy me a Starbucks. Oh, how I dislike Starbucks. Well, coffee in general. Their coffee is as bad as anyone else's.
 
1. ScubaBoard threads are often feature the advice to stop paying for classes and just start diving with a more experienced Mentor who can guide you as you progress. Of course, how you are to be able to tell a good Mentor from a fool who talks a good game is not explained.

2. In my recent conversations with PADI that led to revisions in the language for the wreck diving class, I was reminded that they recommend that divers stay within the limits of their training and experience. The "and experience" part includes the diving you do outside of training, with or without a trusted mentor.
You’re supposed to gain your experience while staying within your training level. You should know your training level because you read it, did it, and were tested for it.
Of course divers will dive outside of their training level, this is called human curiosity plus a bunch of other stuff.
I’m just saying in technical terms how it is written and how it’s designed to be.
It’s all in the manual, read the manual.
 
You’re supposed to gain your experience while staying within your training level. You should know your training level because you read it, did it, and were tested for it.
Of course divers will dive outside of their training level, this is called human curiosity plus a bunch of other stuff.
I’m just saying in technical terms how it is written and how it’s designed to be.
It’s all in the manual, read the manual.
I have read the training manual. I have taught it. I have talked extensively with PADI about it, as I wrote earlier.

You do not have to stay within the limits of training ALONE. If you are OW certified to 60 feet, you do not have to stay at 60 feet until you get your AOW, at which point you are allowed to go to 100 feet. You are allowed to increase your limits through training and experience. Please show me in the manual where I am wrong.
 
Very interesting thread with a lot to think about.

Personally, I believe that the "Far West " days of scuba diving are numbered. In 50 years from now, most countries will require a Diving License, in exactly the same way as they currently require a driver's licence if you want to drive an automobile. The theoretical, practical and attitudes diving skills will be determined by the state, and scuba agencies will have to abide by these norms and standards, which will have become international. A state-run examination agency will determine objectively if a diver can be allowed to dive or not, and will either emit a permit, or fail the student.

The importance of crucial topics like task-loading, situational awareness, check-lists, detailed dive planning, proper trim and buoyancy skills, and other accident-prevention strategies, will be introduced to the students from day #1.

I look forward very much to this state of affairs.
 
if an OW diver increases the depth to which they dive gradually, that they understand the effects of narcosis, that they learn proper gas planning, then they are acquiring reasonable experience. Let's say a newly certified divers does 3 dives to 60 feet at the site to which they were certified. Next 3 are to 6
If it’s like getting a drivers license, don’t count on it improving anything.
It depends on the country. Maybe US divers won't improve, but German and Finnish ones should have a high bar.
 
Well, the Far West was in the USA, right ? So that country will probably be the last of the developed countries to adopt a Diving Licence legislation. :wink:
 
If it’s like getting a drivers license, don’t count on it improving anything.

Come to think of it, a Diving Licence would be more akin to an Airplane Pilot's Licence.
 
We can. For a useful analogy consider the U.S. highway system. I live in the south, and a number of areas have a 70 mph speed limit. Including some that, years ago, had a 55 mph limit. I suspect if one were to implement (& effectively enforce) a new federal law making the max. speed limit anywhere in the U.S. 40 mph, highway fatalities would go down significantly. People would have more time to react to spontaneous situations (e.g.: kid runs out in the road), collisions would involve less momentum/force, etc...

But I don't want a universal 40 mph speed limit. Apparently most don't. Even though it would very likely save lives. Even though I, or a loved one, might be amongst the body count we pay for higher speed limits.

That said, some time back I saw a program indicating Texas considered a 90 mph speed limit, but the breaking distance and potential for loss of control of a vehicle, IIRC, were concerns. So there's a point where we act, and a point where we don't.

Actions to reduce accidents have a 'cost.' Could be bothersome (e.g.: mandatory check list, boat crew enforced), expensive and time consuming (e.g.: AOW required for this trip) or outright exclusionary (e.g.: we ban asthmatics, diabetics & people over 50 from diving).

Neither the U.S. highway or scuba hobby fatality rates are going to stay at zero. You can be ever mindful emerging technologies/techniques may offer new, practical, low-cost ways to cut into risk...but that preserving assess to the hobby and reasonable individual liberty means we're going to accept some deaths.

The mindset I'm concerned about comes from observing the influence of some regulatory agencies on business policy. It goes something like this - bad things aren't supposed to happen. When one does, 'something more' should've been done to prevent it. We must now enact a new, burdensome policy with a new requirement so in theory the bad thing won't happen again (it will). If we don't, the regulators will get us. That mindset can be a productive tool in the hands of the wise, or a red tape machine in the hands of fools (or people afraid of regulatory fools).

Richard.

I am a nurse.

I am the last person a lot of people see before they die.

After they die the doctor usually tells the family their loved one has died, but some times he is busy and I do that.

Then I spend time with the family and explain what happened, why they died and what we did to try to save them.

My goal is to that for a scuba diver zero times.
 

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