Why aren't more people taking up scuba diving?

[NorthernLights]

I agree with Eric, there are some things that should be prepared for better in training. On my first dive in the Seattle area, I had a harbor seal pay us a visit and I almost had a heart attack. I had no idea what to do or what to expect. We don't have them in region and was unprepared for it. Luckily it was just playing with us, and no harm done.

I would also like to mention that the sport is really expensive, unless you are lucky enough to get good equipment used at a reasonable price, or can borrow it until you get your own.

Scuba shops should be trying to entice young people to try it. Perhaps getting Boy Scouts and Girl Scouts interested in it, or looking for other youth organizations to get the next generation of divers hooked.

 

[boulderjohn]

I'm talking about physical skills like buoyancy control, skin diving skills, don a doff skills underwater, proper finning techniques, not rototilling the bottom, not crashing the bottom, gas management, learning your sac rate and doing the math with your cylinder size, swimming skills, profficiency in pool skills then tranferring that to skills in the open water, and making sure everyone was in good shape by making them swim which also makes people more comfortable in the water regardless whether or not swimming is related to diving or not.

I asked for specific standards that were dropped. You list a bunch of skills that you feel are lacking in today's instruction without identifying specific standards that were dropped. . Buoyancy control is still a standard. Skin diving is still a standard.Proper fining technique is still a standard. Not rototilling the bottom and not crashing the bottom are standards in most current agencies, although not in those words, and it is emphasized in the new PADI standards. (By the way, you list buoyancy control as three different items in your list.) When was knowing your SAC rate an OW standard? What specific standards for gas management were dropped?
Again, what specific standards were dropped in the last 30 years that led to the loss of these skills?

Freediving down to the deep end of the pool and putting all your gear on will never happen in real life but it is a valuable skill to train divers to get comfortable and be able to manage awkward situations underwater and develop a higher degree of watermanship skills and comfort level.

Some agencies have dropped this exercise. Some haven't. Those who dropped it have done it partially for the reason you describe (it has no actual relationship to diving) and partially because it is unnecessarily dangerous. A couple of years ago a student taking a scuba class at the University of Alabama died while performing this exercise.

Even some mild friendly harassment wouldn't be a bad thing, it would prepare divers for things like getting side swiped by sea lions, having unexpected mask dislodgings, and being able to deal with other surprise events that can happen during an ordinary recreational dive.

That is an instructional practice, not a standard.

You said "They dropped the standards repeatedly;" I am still waiting for the list of standards that have disappeared in this process of "dropping the standards repeatedly" in the last 30 years. Can you name even one?

---------- Post added January 13th, 2014 at 01:17 PM ----------

I agree with Eric, there are some things that should be prepared for better in training. On my first dive in the Seattle area, I had a harbor seal pay us a visit and I almost had a heart attack. I had no idea what to do or what to expect. We don't have them in region and was unprepared for it. Luckily it was just playing with us, and no harm done.

I taught the confined water sessions and academic portion of the class this weekend. What standard should be added to the instruction to prepare students for the sudden appearance of harbor seals so that they will not be startled?

 

[NorthernLights]

I guess it wouldn't be a standard, but the point still stands that maybe we could do a better job of helping new divers prepare for unexpected things in the water.

There is an awful lot to cover in the training sessions, and I think some trainers do it well, others not so well. It is clear to me, reading your posts, boulderjohn, that you are conscientious, but not all instructors are so good. Another thing are some of the dive operators in tourist locations that don't take safety serious enough. My dive buddy was recently in Mexico and he was with a buddy who was newly OW certified, and the DM took them to nearly 100 feet. That is insane.

 

[boulderjohn]

I have been a major proponent of improving scuba instruction. PADI has told me directly that my efforts were part of what led to their recent improvements and additions to their OW standards. I have told the story repeatedly that I was certified in the 1990s in a 3-day course, and the only way they were able to certify me in only 3 days was by skipping a bunch of standards. I deplore that kind of thing.

But that is because of the decisions of local shops and instructors to skimp on the standards. My niece was certified by NAUI a few years ago after a couple of hours in the pool and one OW dive to 10 feet. Do you think that was within NAUI standards?

The idea that over the past few decades the agencies have been repeatedly dropping standards is simply not true. If individual instructors, like the ones who taught both me and my niece, are reported for violating standards, then the agencies can do something about it. In my case, I did not realize how many standards were violated for too many years. Since then I have reported several violations, and in each case I know something was done about it.

 

[redacted]

The biggest change in training is the 2 to 4 fold increase in cost over the past 20 years. When it costs $400 to $800 (OW + gear) to see if you like it, don't be surprised to find a scarcity of tasters.

 

[Locus]

A big gripe I have about how some shops train now is that, being aware of the low retention rate among divers, they push newbies to enroll in as many classes as they can as quickly as possible in order to maximize the profit they can make off of them before they can decide diving isn't their thing.

For example, I rescheduled my AOW class a few times (weeks ahead of the class dates) due to not feeling practiced enough and comfortable enough with my equipment setup to want to take more in-depth lessons. After explaining this to a rep from the shop, I was told that AOW is simply an extension of the basic class and that I should go ahead with it asap. Fast forward to my AOW navigation dive. My buddy and I are trying to lead each other around following compass headings and we're both bouncing off the bottom and struggling to swim in straight lines. Not really the educational experience I was looking for. I feel like I'm just now getting my basics solid enough to get the full value out of AOW classes, but of course that money has long since been spent.

And then there's my buddy's experience...

Before I was certified, she got us both living social coupons to get lessons at an LDS, but despite having called the shop beforehand to double-check the final price of the class she wanted, she got hit with multiple added fees once she was enrolled. She completed her pool sessions, but on her dive day she woke up with a sinus cold, unable to equalize, and had to reschedule ($100 rescheduling fee + equipment rental).

The shop only does an AOW class once every month or two, so she ended up doing her advanced dives with me (she was doing her AOW/Drysuit pool sessions at the time I was just doing my OW). That weekend was hell for her. She was just coming off of a brutal stomach flu and really wasn't up to the strain of 3 dives a day, but if she had rescheduled again she would have been charged yet another $100 penalty, and she was already shelling out about $900 just for her AOW/Drysuit certs. So she pushed through it, rushing through everything to meet the minimum course requirements and not really taking anything away from what could have been a really fun and worthwhile class.

My #1 piece of advice to new divers in my area? Don't use livingsocial/groupon for classes.

 

[TMHeimer]

Obviously Boulderjohn is right up on the lack of changes in standards (apparently at least in recent decades--I read that courses were way longer before that). Regarding the other point of preparing divers better for open ocean, that would be nice. In my first year I often thought "why didn't she mention that?" Now DMing (and before that) I realised it's not remotely possible to cover more than the basics in a weekend pool course. Some instructors add in this odd bit of info. and others that bit, but it's basically cover all the skills and safety situations.

 

[boulderjohn]

Obviously Boulderjohn is right up on the lack of changes in standards (apparently at least in recent decades--I read that courses were way longer before that)..

If you go back 50 years to the earliest days of scuba instruction, yes, there is a difference. Back then there were only two certification levels--diver and instructor. Getting certified as a diver took a long time, and it was very expensive. That instruction included pretty much everything you could know about scuba except instruction. That changed with the modular approach of teaching used by all agencies I know of today, with different levels of classes and having students decide how far they want to go with their instruction. That was a major change, and it happened nearly 50 years ago. That is why I asked about the last 30 years. I almost extended it to the last 40 years, but I am a bit hazy about things then.

 

[scubadada]

I spent more than half of today "diving". I got up in the morning and packed gear for myself and the stuff I was lending my dive buddy(ies). I got dressed and left the house at 9 for a meet time at 10. Then I spent more than an hour adjusting my gear to my dive buddy, and wondering where the other fellow was (he was jetlagged and had overslept). Eventually, we got in the water, and our total dive time was about 20 minutes, because my buddy was a brand new diver, and I had brought him a 72 cubic foot tank, which is all we have that has air in it. Oh, did I mention that the wind was howling and the rain was pelting, and almost everybody else was smart enough not to go outside today?

After our dive, I declared I was wimping out of more diving in the thunder, lightning, and POURING rain, and my buddy and I had a cup of tea in the nearby restaurant and then I went home. I got home at 1:30 pm, and I haven't YET taken all the gear out of the truck and washed it and put it away. 4 1/2 hours spent for 20 minutes underwater, and another hour of cleanup work yet to do, and all of it in absolutely FOUL weather.

Yeah, I wonder why people don't sign up to do this. Actually, I wonder why those of us who it, do!

Because we'll do most anything to dve

Good diving, Craig

---------- Post added January 13th, 2014 at 07:40 PM ----------

The gear morphing into what it is now is a little disturbing to me too. And all of it to cover bad skills for people who weren't going to stay in anyway.

Hi Eric, what gear covers for bad skills, bad skills seems blatently obvious to me?

Good diving, Craig

---------- Post added January 13th, 2014 at 07:43 PM ----------

It's not surprising that GUE is expanding, as it's a relatively small group of converts. They're not ones to quit diving. The problem is lack of expansion of the sport among the masses. It's evident as I've not seen new scuba shops opening, but some have closed. It's not that the sport is dying; it's just not expanding.

In fact, the GUE, DIR folks are self-selected to continue

---------- Post added January 13th, 2014 at 08:08 PM ----------

You hear this all the time. How true is it?

Can you identify who "they" are and give specific examples of standards that have been dropped repeatedly over the last 30 years?

I was certified in the 1990s, and I have my original materials. The only real difference I can think of is that buddy breathing used to be optional at the OW level for PADI, but it is not taught there at all any more. There are some who call that a dropping of standards, but it was done after a safety analysis revealed that it is a dangerous practice that is not in any way necessary--there are better alternatives. Some disagree, but I don't. As a trained buddy breather, I will still do a CESA any day before putting myself at risk of the practices of someone else in a buddy breathing situation. (As in, will I get that regulator back or not?)

Another change is that students have the option to take the course with computer training rather than tables. That is not a dropping of standards--it is an alternative. As someone who teaches both versions, I assure you that if you teach the computer version properly, it takes just as long.

So, what are the specific standards that have been dropped over the past 30 years?

For us older guys with earlier training, this is very obvious. I was certified by LA Co Underwater Unit in 1970. My OW course was far more rigorous than the 1997 PADI course I took with my 12 year old son. There was more classroom time, more pool time and more OW dive time, 6 dives if I remember correctly, 4 shore and 2 boat (to Catalina). This is all despite the fact that there was less information and support available. Navy tables, no alternative algorithms or dive computers (dive computers???) There were no alternate air sources, you buddy breathed. I was relatively advanced and had both a SPG and a capillary depth gauge, many had only a J valve and no depth gauge. We did a real CESA, no humming into the regulator.

I'm all for modern times and very much appreciate my current equipment such as an AI primary computer and a backup computer and SPG. Still...my early experiences have made me a better diver.

---------- Post added January 13th, 2014 at 08:19 PM ----------

I'm not talking about tables vs computers, that trend is fine. I'm all about absorbing new technology into diving. Doing the book work on the computer doesn't matter as much either as long as they get it and understand it.
I'm talking about physical skills like buoyancy control, skin diving skills, don a doff skills underwater, proper finning techniques, not rototilling the bottom, not crashing the bottom, gas management, learning your sac rate and doing the math with your cylinder size, swimming skills, profficiency in pool skills then tranferring that to skills in the open water, and making sure everyone was in good shape by making them swim which also makes people more comfortable in the water regardless whether or not swimming is related to diving or not. Buddy breathing is a passe skill but still valuable as a pool skill because of the stress management benefits.
Freediving down to the deep end of the pool and putting all your gear on will never happen in real life but it is a valuable skill to train divers to get comfortable and be able to manage awkward situations underwater and develop a higher degree of watermanship skills and comfort level. Even some mild friendly harassment wouldn't be a bad thing, it would prepare divers for things like getting side swiped by sea lions, having unexpected mask dislodgings, and being able to deal with other surprise events that can happen during an ordinary recreational dive.
They have incrementally reduced profficiency or done away with a lot of this stuff now to be able to do a three day course in record time which IMO isn't enough time to get anybody ready for the open ocean.
If it was several more days of training in the pool and more dives in the ocean or quarry or lake it would be more expensive and take way more time, which is what "they" the scuba industry (dive shops, instructors, dive resorts and centers, and even gear manufacturers to some degree) DON'T want. It's bad for business.
But in the big picture it's bad for diving and erodes the integrity of the sport.

Yes, like being a relatively strong and competent swimmer. Sorry, I have no interest in being paired up with an essentially non-swimming buddy. When everything is cool, this is not an issue. When push comes to shove, this can make all the difference in the world. I've been buddied up with folks that could not swim in current. Not only did they suck down all their air but they required assistance in making it back to the ascent line. This kind of certification is not acceptable.

---------- Post added January 13th, 2014 at 08:27 PM ----------

If you go back 50 years to the earliest days of scuba instruction, yes, there is a difference. Back then there were only two certification levels--diver and instructor. Getting certified as a diver took a long time, and it was very expensive. That instruction included pretty much everything you could know about scuba except instruction. That changed with the modular approach of teaching used by all agencies I know of today, with different levels of classes and having students decide how far they want to go with their instruction. That was a major change, and it happened nearly 50 years ago. That is why I asked about the last 30 years. I almost extended it to the last 40 years, but I am a bit hazy about things then.

44 years, that's about right. I'm still occasionally diving my Scubapro Mk 5/ R109

 

[Eric Sedletzky]

30 years isn't enough time, you Boulderjohn decided on that number not me.
In the last 30 years that I can think of they did away with buddy breathing, the swim or fin/snorkel, you used to have to do both,
and tables. There might be more but I need to see.
They also dropped the age limit but I don't count that necessarily as a negative.
I don't know about all the others.
Instead of 30 years I'm going to go back 45 years before the big revamp.
I need some time to research and compile all the info from all the different agencies, so I'll be back.
I am interested in all the specific details myself from all the agencies and how they compare between then and now.
I can tell you it's going to be drastic.