Whose moronic idea was it to stamp the cylinder crown?

[Dapper Dan]

The mods never explain this for a variety of reasons, but he was certainly suspected of being a bot by many people.

Bots and other fake personalities have long been a problem in social media. With the growing sophistication of bots, it can be very hard to tell the difference these days. There was another frequent poster a few years ago who was similarly accused frequently, and a mod statement was made saying that he had been checked and found to be real. Not long after that he was banned, so I think further research made a change in thinking.

There was another person whose behavior was pretty trollish who was also accused of being a bot. He took a number of positions contrary to normal thinking and argued for them vigorously. He was then supported by another poster who claimed to have excellent credentials but whose identity was also challenged. (If your credentials are as good as claimed, your true identity can be found.) I later received a private message from a well-known poster telling me that he had received a private message from someone telling him that main poster was not a real person and it was all some sort of experiment that was now over. Neither of those posters ever posted again.

I wonder what the Internet will be like in 100 years. Will there actually be any real humans on the Internet?
Remember pay phones? Back in the early 90's I spent 1/3 of my 7pm to 7am shift in Houston chasing prank 9-1-1 calls from pay phones.

 

[BoltSnap]

Back in the early 90's I spent 1/3 of my 7pm to 7am shift in Houston chasing prank 9-1-1 calls from pay phones

What were the most memorable ones?

 

[Learner Diver]

The idea of a QR code as proposed by the individual/bot that started this thread was to replace the hydro stamp. While it may look nicer, won't perform nearly as well. Stickers might stay for a while, or they may come off after a couple years. Stamps in the metal are an accepted practice and seem to be working just fine. The QR code is a solution in search of a problem and creates other problems.

QR code would need to be scannable. First, a device to decode would be needed, a smart phone would likely work, but it's extra effort to scan it versus just looking quickly at the stamps. Additionally, as a sticker i

Toyota motor corporation invented the QR code for their warehouse logistics several decades ago. iPhone can scan any QR code. Anyone can punch a stamp into the crown and take the cylinder to their LDS and have it filled. QR code can tell the LDS, the owner's name, year of manufacturer, test date, inspection date. Whether it's been rolled, etc. Stickers don't fade or come off in salt water.

 

[OMyMyOHellYes]

Toyota motor corporation invented the QR code for their warehouse logistics several decades ago. iPhone can scan any QR code. Anyone can punch a stamp into the crown and take the cylinder to their LDS and have it filled. QR code can tell the LDS, the owner's name, year of manufacturer, test date, inspection date. Whether it's been rolled, etc. Stickers don't fade or come off in salt water.

Needs to be user readable using only human eyesight, not requiring intervention of other tech. Testing gas content is enough of a PITA. The last thing I want to see show up on my boat is everyone carrying their cell phone.

 

[Wibble]

No of course stickers don't come off in salt water, they last forever. Everyone knows this.

/sarcasm off

You didn't open the sarcasm mode.

/pedant off

 

[BoltSnap]

Anyone can punch a stamp into the crown and take the cylinder to their LDS and have it filled.

And you have done studies and have vast experience exceeding the experience and knowledge of the industry experts, federal government and all authorities in field around the globe?

 

[Belzelbub]

Toyota motor corporation invented the QR code for their warehouse logistics several decades ago.

OK. Not sure what Toyota's inventory tracking and logistics needs have to do with a Scuba tank Hydro markings. If a dive operation wants to add an additional sticker for tracking their inventory, that's fine.

iPhone can scan any QR code.

I'm aware of that. I included that in several posts on this topic. When I bring tanks to get filled, I often bring multiple. Quite often, the dive shop employee may be helping me transport a couple through the shop. My hands are full, their hands are also full. Their eyes work hands free.

Anyone can punch a stamp into the crown and take the cylinder to their LDS and have it filled. QR code can tell the LDS, the owner's name, year of manufacturer, test date, inspection date. Whether it's been rolled, etc.

Yes, anyone can punch a stamp into the crown. Likewise, it's quite easy to get a sticker. I'm certain it wouldn't take me very long to find someone who would make me a bunch of stickers with a QR code that reads whatever I want.

Stickers don't fade or come off in salt water.

They absolutely do. I've got some stickers on my cylinders. Some came with the NITROX Green/Yellow band. I removed them as they were basically flaking off in large sections. The VIP sticker is removed and replaced every year, but even those show signs of damage quickly. Tanks are not handled with kid gloves. They are in a rough environment and get beat up.

Below is from the US Code of Federal Regulations part 49 section 180.213

"Placement of markings. Each cylinder must be plainly and permanently marked on the metal of the cylinder as permitted by the applicable specification. Unless authorized by the cylinder specification, marking on the cylinder sidewall is prohibited."

It goes on to state that markings must be legible, and that previous markings may not be obliterated until there is no more room. It also goes on to state how markings should be applied.

Permanent is the problem with a simple label. The CFR I mentioned above actually does provide for a method to use a label. Caveat is that it must be embedded in epoxy. I wonder why we don't see that in practice. That would add time and cost. Additionally, the information to be included in the marking is spelled out.

You mentioned the following pieces of information that should be included in this label.

LDS: No clue why this is important, but this is included in the Annual VIP sticker.
Owner's Name: Again, not sure why this is important. And If I sell a tank, does that mean the new owner can't get it filled/requalified?
Year of Manufacture: Included in the original manufacturer's markings as the original hydro date. Passing the original hydro is the date that it actually becomes a pressure vessel.
Test Date: See above.
Inspection Date: What inspection date? If you mean Requalification date, then that is included in the stamp which is an approved method.
Rolled Status: Why would this be relevant? It almost sounds like you want a TankFax in place. If there was demand, all that could likely be done with just the SN of the tank. That's the identifier. Now you'd have to get a bunch of requalifiers and dive shops on board to make this happen. I don't find it likely as the rest of the world seems to be fine with the current process.

I have no idea what the requirements are in the UK. In the US, an epoxy embedded label is an option for a permanent mark. If this were a better option than the stamping method most often used, then I'm sure we'd see it. I suspect it comes down to cost. A set of stamping tools and the associated labor is probably cheaper than a printer, label stock, and epoxy application.

Bottom line, I don't see this changing anytime soon. Since you are in the UK, maybe reach out to King Charles and see if he can get this on the PM's agenda.

 

[BoltSnap]

Bottom line, I don't see this changing anytime soon. Since you are in the UK, maybe reach out to King Charles and see if he can get this on the PM's agenda.

Lol

 

[high_order1]

Toyota motor corporation invented the QR code for their warehouse logistics several decades ago. iPhone can scan any QR code. Anyone can punch a stamp into the crown and take the cylinder to their LDS and have it filled. QR code can tell the LDS, the owner's name, year of manufacturer, test date, inspection date. Whether it's been rolled, etc. Stickers don't fade or come off in salt water.

Lasers have dropped significantly in the last ten years. Be pretty easy to bzzt a code into the metal.
From a metallurgical standpoint, I wonder what is less damaging to the substrate?

Everybody has a cellphone. I have seen other tanks over the years that I almost had to take scrubbies to in order to read the mismash of characters; everyone has a cellphone now.

Not really weighing in one way or another. I am no fan of how deep some people beat stamps into thinner tanks though.

 

[Belzelbub]

Lasers have dropped significantly in the last ten years. Be pretty easy to bzzt a code into the metal.
From a metallurgical standpoint, I wonder what is less damaging to the substrate?

There was a trend not long ago with people etching designs on their tanks. Many of the cylinder manufacturers issued advisories against laser etching tanks. So, it seems they’ve decided that the stamping is less detrimental.