Just so we don't get mired down in terminology problems as well, an octo is intended to be passed to the OOA diver. A backup is used by the donating diver after passing off the primary (it's a "backup" for the primary).
Roak
Which regulator should you donate?
- Thread starter Wendy
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Roak
Because I want to give my buddy and I the best chance of survival. That's what seperates a buddy TEAM from the "my air, you can suck water" crowd.
Donating the octo doesn't give my buddy and I the best possible chance of survival because you do not have the level of control, the level of test and the level of reliability with an octo anchored out of sight and out of mind.
You may consider your buddy disposable, I don't.
You don't even have a filament, do you?
Roak
Maybe Im just masochistic today, but what the heck.
The problem you have, Cincy, is you have definitions way, way off from the rest of the world. We found out in the other note that you only consider a regulator failed if its not delivering air at all. A slashed diaphragm delivering copious amounts of water making the regulator unusable was not considered failed by you.
You also have a strange definition of OOA. Your definition is whenever you dont have a working (the rest of the worlds definition of working, not yours) regulator in your mouth. When my reg gets kicked out of my mouth, I dont consider myself OOA. In fact the entire recreational world doesnt consider having a reg out of your mouth an OOA situation, which is why theres the reg retrieval drills. If you lose your reg you dont go looking for another diver to share air with, as you would do in a real OOA situation, you simply retrieve the reg and continue.
Pulling the reg out of my mouth to give it to an OOA diver doesnt make me OOA, its no different than me losing my regulator. But instead of going for the regulator I lost I simply go for the one under my chin and voila I have air again. I have successfully retrieved my regulator.
To use someone elses analogy, Switching regulators is to being OOA as Blinking is to closing your eyes. Its a non-issue. Doesnt deserve consideration. A moot point. Irrelevant. How many different ways can it be stated?
So this constant yapping about two divers being OOA doesnt jibe with the rest of the industry at all, including your own training organization. If it did, youd be teaching divers to swim to their buddy drawing their hands across their throat the moment the reg fell out of their mouths by accident. Methinks you need to find some better definitionis.
Either that or you really are totally scared to death about giving up your primary. I guess I would be too if I was an octo dragger, Id never know what kind of junk it picked up when I wasnt looking.
But we dont drag our backups across the reef. And thats why we have such a high level of confidence in them working; the mere thought that after numerous tests they wouldnt work doesnt enter our minds. Itll work, no question.
Roak
The problem you have, Cincy, is you have definitions way, way off from the rest of the world. We found out in the other note that you only consider a regulator failed if its not delivering air at all. A slashed diaphragm delivering copious amounts of water making the regulator unusable was not considered failed by you.
You also have a strange definition of OOA. Your definition is whenever you dont have a working (the rest of the worlds definition of working, not yours) regulator in your mouth. When my reg gets kicked out of my mouth, I dont consider myself OOA. In fact the entire recreational world doesnt consider having a reg out of your mouth an OOA situation, which is why theres the reg retrieval drills. If you lose your reg you dont go looking for another diver to share air with, as you would do in a real OOA situation, you simply retrieve the reg and continue.
Pulling the reg out of my mouth to give it to an OOA diver doesnt make me OOA, its no different than me losing my regulator. But instead of going for the regulator I lost I simply go for the one under my chin and voila I have air again. I have successfully retrieved my regulator.
To use someone elses analogy, Switching regulators is to being OOA as Blinking is to closing your eyes. Its a non-issue. Doesnt deserve consideration. A moot point. Irrelevant. How many different ways can it be stated?
So this constant yapping about two divers being OOA doesnt jibe with the rest of the industry at all, including your own training organization. If it did, youd be teaching divers to swim to their buddy drawing their hands across their throat the moment the reg fell out of their mouths by accident. Methinks you need to find some better definitionis.
Either that or you really are totally scared to death about giving up your primary. I guess I would be too if I was an octo dragger, Id never know what kind of junk it picked up when I wasnt looking.
But we dont drag our backups across the reef. And thats why we have such a high level of confidence in them working; the mere thought that after numerous tests they wouldnt work doesnt enter our minds. Itll work, no question.
Roak
Yo bartender it's 5 o'clock somewhere...and I need a drink!
30 minutes from now here in Colorado!
Roak
I consider the concept of expecting to be able to use a buddy as a primary back up sourse of air in an OOA situation flawed. Based on observation and practical experience of buddying with several hundred individuals from different training agencies I reckon the only practical method with any reasonable chance of success in a real emergency, is to carry an independant alternative air source.
A bungy necklace is a potential noose around your neck and if you ever release your equipment in a hurry, there will be a heavy weight at the end of it.
A bungy necklace is a potential noose around your neck and if you ever release your equipment in a hurry, there will be a heavy weight at the end of it.
At which point it'll pop off the mouthpiece and be gone along with your equipment.
Non problem.
Roak
Mine didn't. 
I can only speak for correctly configured equipment.
Roak
When diving with a main single cylinder I prefer my pony 2nd stage reg to be held in the right shoulder D ring. I sometimes dive with a goody bag around my neck when harvesting ensis saligna (razor clam).
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