Which One First: Cave 1 or Tech 1?

[Bismark]

At the risk of massive oversimplification, C1 is mostly "bottom work" while T1 has both "bottom work" and "mid-water work". T1 lecture/review time also has to cover both skill sets and decompression. But both classes run about the same length. I'd suggest C1 and then T1. YMMV.

The limited exposure you get to line work in Tech I or even Tech II is not really sufficient for even the most weeny wreck penetration. It is not a line work course. It is just an introduction to show you how much drama and task loading it can add to an already "exciting" situation. Couple that with deco and a ticking clock and you are going to go into "heavy drama" mode very quickly.

To the OP, you showed the patience required to develop the skill set necessary to get a tech pass in Fundamentals. I suggest you apply that same patience to further training. There is no quick way to do this stuff and I don't know of anyone going from pre-fundamentals to Tech II in less than 2+ years. And for him he averaged about 300-350 dives a year all over the world in both warm and cold water environments and was very focused. His wife was very understanding about missing the house renovation and enjoyed the travelling also.........

Relax, enjoy the learning curve and you will get there. Doing this this stuff at a sustainable pace with comfort and a growing skill set will mean huge payoffs in the end and very little drama along the way. I believe in the view that while the hare will sometimes cross the finish line before the turtle, the turtle always makes it across the finish line, while sometimes the hare gets........'distracted'.

Guy

 

[gxsr_sarge]

(edit) I didn't realize you changed to much shallower wrecks. T1+C1 and some experience will be adequate for recreational depths (130ish) if you are conservative and do limited penetrations. By the time 150ft rolls around you are burning through gas and racking up deco with any little delay that you really need the multiple deco gases and a bottom stage to do anything substantive.

I guess "deep" is a relative term. Penetrating a wreck b/t 100' - 150' is deep for me.

At the risk of massive oversimplification, C1 is mostly "bottom work" while T1 has both "bottom work" and "mid-water work". T1 lecture/review time also has to cover both skill sets and decompression. But both classes run about the same length. I'd suggest C1 and then T1. YMMV.

lamont, thanks. That helps quite a bit.

 

[gxsr_sarge]

Bismark, your advice and input is very much appreciated!

 

[rjack321]

I guess "deep" is a relative term. Penetrating a wreck b/t 100' - 150' is deep for me.

I realize that.

In my area, 150ft is exponentially deeper than 1ata less at 120ft. I realize that in S. FL that progression might seem less pronounced (since you can probably see down to 150ft from 100ft). But its still a big jump in terms of deco obligations and gas reserves. Especially once you are diving ~1/4ths of usable gas. And once you are considering Tech2 depths (150+) its exponentially that much bigger of a dive from 150ft.

Are their any wrecks in your area that are in the 60-90ft range? You can do short penetrations in that depth range with "just" Cave1. Adding Tech1 to the Cave1 probably gets you down to 120-130ft range for penetrations (with sufficient prudence) and 160ft for exterior looky loos. Doing penetrations at 160ft (Tech1 limits) would be very unwise.

Tech2 would then theoretically expand your depth range to 200ft+ but still not very extensive penetrations. If you felt it necessary for your dives after getting to this point, Cave2 would then add sigificant horizontal penetrations onto all your prior experience. So big penetrations at 200ft depths are something that are probably in your 2012 plans - if ever. After some of these classes your objectives may very well change (mine have).

 

[gxsr_sarge]

Are their any wrecks in your area that are in the 60-90ft range?

There are (but not as "grand") but that's a great idea! It will definitely hone my skills.

I had always planned to take Cave 1 and Tech 1 & 2 over the next few years. Based on your and other's feedback, it look's like I can really benefit from taking Cave 1 first and then move on to Tech 1 (and then perhaps Cave 2, then Tech 2 - my 5 year plan). I'll always be a student for the rest of my life so I know that the other courses, as well as perhaps the UTD Wreck courses, will be in my education path.

Thanks again to all for your valuable opinions.

 

[Bismark]

I realize that.

In my area, 150ft is exponentially deeper than 1ata less at 120ft. I realize that in S. FL that progression might seem less pronounced (since you can probably see down to 150ft from 100ft). But its still a big jump in terms of deco obligations and gas reserves. Especially once you are diving ~1/4ths of usable gas. And once you are considering Tech2 depths (150+) its exponentially that much bigger of a dive from 150ft.

Are their any wrecks in your area that are in the 60-90ft range? You can do short penetrations in that depth range with "just" Cave1. Adding Tech1 to the Cave1 probably gets you down to 120-130ft range for penetrations (with sufficient prudence) and 160ft for exterior looky loos. Doing penetrations at 160ft (Tech1 limits) would be very unwise.

Tech2 would then theoretically expand your depth range to 200ft+ but still not very extensive penetrations. If you felt it necessary for your dives after getting to this point, Cave2 would then add sigificant horizontal penetrations onto all your prior experience. So big penetrations at 200ft depths are something that are probably in your 2012 plans - if ever. After some of these classes your objectives may very well change (mine have).

I absolutely agree with everything Richard has said. I especially like the last comment that "after some of these classes your objectives may very well change". You may discover that you have some limits that you didn't know you had. At this point, "you don't know what you don't know". For me personally I kept telling myself that my limit was going to be "x" feet and "x" amount of time, but that changed with more training. I finally settled in to a comfort zone that was deeper and longer by quite a bit than what I originally thought I wanted to do, but I also found that this limit was shallower than what can be accomplished within the limits of my current training envelope. Like I said, "I didn't know what I didn't know".

You will find your limits also and discover "what you don't know now".

It is one hell of a ride though!

 

[rjack321]

There are (but not as "grand") but that's a great idea! It will definitely hone my skills.

I had always planned to take Cave 1 and Tech 1 & 2 over the next few years. Based on your and other's feedback, it look's like I can really benefit from taking Cave 1 first and then move on to Tech 1 (and then perhaps Cave 2, then Tech 2 - my 5 year plan). I'll always be a student for the rest of my life so I know that the other courses, as well as perhaps the UTD Wreck courses, will be in my education path.

Thanks again to all for your valuable opinions.

And it gets you wreck penetration diving, which is hopefully more important than depth

I think experience on wrecks is probably more important than anything - either inside but shallow where minor mistakes aren't as critical or deeper and outside where the "new to you" parts of the dive are actually after the wreck (the deco). If you are taking both in the relatively short term I don't think the order is super critical.

Warning tho, you may drop all the ocean diving once you're addicted to caves

 

[TSandM]

Yeah, what's rusted metal compared with wet rocks

 

[gxsr_sarge]

Yeah, what's rusted metal compared with wet rocks

I've read your other posts and gathered that you were an avid caver. Not sure if you are GUE but where (and with you whom) did you take Cave 1?

 

[TSandM]

I took Cave 1 from Danny in Mexico, and then I did a reeval as a buddy for a friend with Fred. Both are excellent teachers, with very different styles. I would take another class from either of them (and I probably will, as Cave 2 is on the menu for this summer).