When to call a dive... a question of limits.

[rduquesnoy]

It's funny how many in this thread claim bad vis as their reason for calling a dive.

While nobody should ever question your buddy's reason to call a dive (the thumb is a command, not a request, we'll discuss the issue when we have solid ground under our feet), it's interesting to me that while I've never called a dive due to vis, I've called dives due to surface conditions. Granted, I've never been in really crappy vis (my worst dive ever had some 1-2m vis), I've always found that that hasn't been a serious concern to me. Getting into and out of the water without being uncomfortably thrown around, on the other hand...

I would not call a dive for 1-2m visability. In the Netherlands it is very likely that at some point during your dive the visibility will be that bad.
When I mean bad visibility I really mean 0, noting. To the point where you can't even read your instruments. That just sucks.

 

[Hoag]

Zero vis = calling the dive.

If I cannot see my hand in front of me, I also can't see my buddy.

Did this once in Roatan after a storm. I'd rather have a beer and watch the murky waves roll in, then be blundering around in them.

Yup. There are definitely days when the conditions mean that the best decision was summed up by Otis Redding:

"I'm sittin' on the dock of the bay
Watching the tide roll away
Oh, I'm just sittin' on the dock of the bay
Wastin' time"

 

[Lorenzoid]

I'm sure there have been a number of instances in which I have called dives before they began, and not all for safety-related reasons. I recall one time, having the previous day done the 9-hour drive to S. Florida, standing in chest-deep water at Blue Heron Bridge and after ducking my head under and being unable to see my hand in front of me, agreeing with my dive buddies that we should go get a beer instead.

 

[Bierstadt]

My second basic tenet for Scuba Diving reads:

You can call a dive at any time for any reason with no questions asked and no repercussions.

That's fine, but not my philosophy. Mine is "You are trusted and relied upon to call a dive at any time for any reason. At that point the dive is over and we'll talk back on the boat." Because your reason for calling a dive is important for me as your dive buddy to know if I am diving with you in the future. I mean, the thumbing diver doesn't have to say anything if he or she doesn't want to, absolutely. But if I don't trust a diver to dive safely, I'm not going to dive with them.

In my actual experience, every cancelled/thumbed dive was by captain's/mutual agreement that the conditions were off, that it was time to head up, diver wasn't feeling well, or because of equipment malfunction. I have also seen plenty of "not feeling it, something isn't right"'s on the boat or upon getting in the water, and those are always met with support and approval for being safe. There are always repercussions to calling or not calling a dive. Like, "I felt that something was off, but I went ahead with the dive anyway and had a freeflow at 100' 5 minutes into the dive. And now everyone is thinking that I screwed up in not calling the dive." Or "I got bored 5 minutes into a wreck dive and called it because it was boring and we're scheduled for another in an hour and my buddy is trying to hook up with another buddy group." Calling a dive when it should be called is a responsibility of every safe diver, and every sensible diver. But... you'd have to be a complete idiot to find a reason to thumb a dive that other divers won't be supportive over. By and large, I think we're a pretty safety-first, supportive bunch.

Vis is an individual thing. I am happy enough in zero vis, watching the particles move past my mask. If my buddy has had enough of that, I am happy to head to a bar instead.

 

[Esprise Me]

I called a dive during a surface swim when I was very new to diving and practically a beach diving virgin. My stomach had been a little unsettled that morning, and it was starting to churn again as I got in the water. I was sweltering from the walk from my car down to the beach in full gear, and the water wasn't cooling me off as much as I'd hoped; I didn't think to pull open the collar of my wetsuit. The group was mostly ahead of me and swimming out faster than I could; I was trying to use my snorkel but waves kept splashing over the top. I looked at how far I'd swum out and how much farther I had to go and worried I might not make it all the way back without help. Back on shore, one of the group leaders who had to sit out the dive due to sinus issues gave me some pointers on surface swimming on my back, which I've done ever since and now know I can easily travel quite some distance that way. I also later figured out I could save myself some discomfort on a hot day by pouring a little water down my wetsuit while gearing up at my car.

I was still renting gear at the time and was a little chagrined to have spent $60 and not dived. When I returned it to the dive shop, they asked me how my dive went, and I sheepishly admitted it didn't. I'll never forget how supportive the guy behind the counter was of my decision; it made me feel like I was being smart instead of a wimp. I've gotten a lot of wisdom from chatting with those guys, but that day's lesson might have been the most important.

 

[The Chairman]

That's fine, but not my philosophy.

Dive and let dive. I think it's important to let your buddy know what's acceptable to you, or not. I don't call dives capriciously, nor do I expect my buddies to do so. It's a trust I have in them that maybe you don't enjoy.

Diving is optional. I don't want to pressure anyone into diving who has any reservations, ever. Yes, I allow my students to call training dives and usually commend them for doing so.

 

[Bierstadt]

Dive and let dive. I think it's important to let your buddy know what's acceptable to you, or not. I don't call dives capriciously, nor do I expect my buddies to do so. It's a trust I have in them that maybe you don't enjoy.

Diving is optional. I don't want to pressure anyone into diving who has any reservations, ever. Yes, I allow my students to call training dives and usually commend them for doing so.

I have a great deal of trust in my buddies. But there are still instabuddies and new divers. I don't understand how you can include "without repercussions" in your motto. Unless you simply aren't diving with people you don't already know, in which case I can understand it, or it is more of an ideal to be held up. Which is fine, of course.

 

[Lorenzoid]

That's fine, but not my philosophy. Mine is "You are trusted and relied upon to call a dive at any time for any reason. At that point the dive is over and we'll talk back on the boat." Because your reason for calling a dive is important for me as your dive buddy to know if I am diving with you in the future. I mean, the thumbing diver doesn't have to say anything if he or she doesn't want to, absolutely. But if I don't trust a diver to dive safely, I'm not going to dive with them.

I have to agree, and I might call that philosophy a corollary to the so-called "Rule." If someone calls a dive and later (say, back on the boat) either offers no explanation or offers one that does not sit well with you, you are not required to say or do anything further, including dive with them again if you don't feel like it. And I'd go a step further and say that the person who called the dive should not be offended by your decision.

This is why I try to dive only with people I feel I know and trust.

Also, as I see it, part of pre-dive planning is agreeing in advance under what conditions the dive might be called.

 

[The Chairman]

I don't understand how you can include "without repercussions" in your motto.

No angry outbursts. No denunciations. No character assassinations. Nothing to punish them them at all. I dive with all sorts. I make it my goal to make sure that they have fun. I have fun when they have fun.

 

[The Chairman]

I've called dives because of my buddy. once, I was on a spear fishing dive when my buddy shot a nice grouper. The long ass shot sent the grouper into a tizzy and Mr Sharky showed up before either of us could even think about killing it proper. Then, for reasons I could not comprehend, my buddy pulled the thrashing Bull shark and grouper right to us and starts hitting it with the butt of his spear gun. Mr Sharky left after he severed the bulk of that grouper. We surfaced and he started getting ready for the next dive and he encouraged me to do the same. Nope. I'm done for the day. Now, he thought I was afraid of sharks. Nope. I was afraid of him.