when to 100'?

[boat sju]

jon m,

I'm curious, was that dive you first talked about at Molokini Crater? I had a similar experience last Christmas. I was happily doing shore dives until the surf kicked up so I had to book a boat dive. Told them to consider me a novice - no problem. Got out to Molokini and found out we were going to look at sharks at 85 - 95 ft. The DM's did babysit us pretty well though (and they've seen it all).

 

[plot]

Within my first 15 dives I went to 126 feet with no problem.

Both of my buddies with me were divecons though... if you're wife/buddy isn't up to the task and isn't going to be able to handle a situation where something could go wrong, then definatly don't do it. It's deffinatly a comfort issue.

 

[Rishidian]

I keep reading about divers saying that you could go deep if you are comfortable. Being comfortable should have nothing to do with the decision to go deep. The emphasis should be on being uncomfortable. As in: DON'T do the dive if you AREN'T comfortable. Also, several have said that they went deep when they weren't fully prepared, and they realized it wasn't a smart decision - but they did it anyway. The message I see is 'it's ok to deep dive while unprepared - just once'. This isn't the message that should be conveyed.

Some of the qualifiers for a deep dive are experience, training, a good buddy, and the right equipment. An experienced diver was lost here in the PNW because he chose to help 2 other divers who were not ready for the deep dive that they did (http://www.scubaboard.com/showthread.php?t=166222). The 'instructor' of the class (who survived) persuaded the 2 inexperienced divers that it would be ok (thus - they were 'comfortable'), but they weren't experienced, had insufficient training (it was their AOW deep dive), had a poor buddy (one of the new divers had the instructor as a buddy, and was abandoned by him), and they were diving on AL80's (they were bouncing to 200fsw). Two other divers chose not to go that deep and stopped at about 60fsw.

When it comes down to it, it's your life. If you choose to go deep, it's your decision. Being comfortable is no reason to go, but being uncomfortable is a great reason to stop.

Everybody on SB wants to hear about what you saw on your dives, so please come back and tell us. My rule of thumb is: Whoever dives down, must come back up.

 

[Tienuts]

There is no legal requirement to be certified at all. The various agencies set standards that apply to their classes. Instructors are bound by those standards while teaching. Agencies also have recommendations for how they believe folks should dive after they are certified. They have no authority to do anything more than recommend.

Thank you Walter, I understand that.

Whatever you want to call it, organizational requirements, guidelines - whatever, there are limits (albeit in a roundabout way) that respective organizations want you to adhere to as far as depth goes.

I'm asking a question to some posts people make, which seem to indicate their OW cards "depth limit" is 130 ft.

I know there is no scuba police.

 

[Walter]

I'm asking a question to some posts people make, which seem to indicate their OW cards "depth limit" is 130 ft.

As far as I'm aware, there are no depth limits on any cards.

 

[OHGoDive]

As far as I'm aware, there are no depth limits on any cards.

PADI Jr. Open Water limits you to diving with a parent/adult to max depth of 12meters/40 feet. It's on the front of the card.

The Jr. Advanced Open Water removes the depth limit, but leaves the parent/adult restriction on the card.

 

[Tienuts]

I can only speak for PADI and TDI/SDI. For each, the standards and requirements say you can only dive to the depth you have been trained for.

Thats why in my first post, I asked what organization were they certified with?

 

[RonFrank]

An experienced diver was lost here in the PNW because he chose to help 2 other divers who were not ready for the deep dive that they did (http://www.scubaboard.com/showthread.php?t=166222). The 'instructor' of the class (who survived) persuaded the 2 inexperienced divers that it would be ok (thus - they were 'comfortable'), but they weren't experienced, had insufficient training (it was their AOW deep dive), had a poor buddy (one of the new divers had the instructor as a buddy, and was abandoned by him), and they were diving on AL80's (they were bouncing to 200fsw). Two other divers chose not to go that deep and stopped at about 60fsw.

Being comfortable is no reason to go, but being uncomfortable is a great reason to stop.

I'm not sure that the PNW incident is a good example of anything other than how serious diving can be, and maybe of an irresponsible instructor. There seems to be a LOT of speculation as to why the events occurred, and who may be to blame.

A further leap is that you assume that the divers were comfortable because an instructor said it's OK. Any certified diver should be aware of the dangers of going deep, and the recommended limits. Suggesting they were comfortable before the dive is pure speculation. People lie, especially if they believe they may face criminal charges. What REALLY happened is one guy died, and they were too deep. Why, how, and who is to blame is all speculation.

When I said "Comfortable" what I mean is that the diver has experience to do the depths they plan. If you have done 90' in an environment, than 100' in a similar environment is what I would consider a *comfort* level.

I'm comfortable with all the dives I plan, and that is a big part of the plan, my comfort level. If I was scared of my plan, well that is an issue.

I doubt ANY of the posters that suggested being comfortable were implying that comfort means someone else telling someone how to feel about a dive. If you are in a steam room about to pass out, the club owner telling you, "I feel great" is NOT going to change your comfort level.

Ultimately each diver is responsible for their decisions and safety. I believe the OP recognizes this. Good for him, as he is working on one thing that makes safer divers, education.

 

[shakeybrainsurgeon]

There is no legal requirement to be certified at all. The various agencies set standards that apply to their classes. Instructors are bound by those standards while teaching. Agencies also have recommendations for how they believe folks should dive after they are certified. They have no authority to do anything more than recommend.

There is a difference between legal requirements and practical requirements. There is, for example, nothing illegal about a pediatrician doing heart surgery --- the law licenses physicians to practice medicine but does not define what medicine they can and can't do.

Practically, however, a pediatrician could not convince a hospital to give him or her operative privileges and an insurance company would never insure them. The gatekeepers here are not the law givers, but the hospitals who run operating rooms, Likewise, the gatekeepers of diving are not governments, but dive shops and dive operators who require certifications before filling tanks and taking people out to deep walls.

If people want to buy compressors and dive off their own boats without training, then they have as much brains as a pediatrician who runs a heart-lung machine out of his garage.

 

[IwakuniDiver]

I admit that I haven't fully read every post in this thread but while perusing through it, I noticed that the general consensus seems to be focusing on setting your limits based on confort level.

Personally, I believe that more emphasis should be put on training first and comfort second. Not fully being trained to recognize the dangers of deep diving can allow someone to feel more comfortable than they should be simply because they don't know what they are getting themselves in to.

For once I'm going to side with Scuba Diving Magazine on an article in this month's issue on deep diving. "Diving at 130 feet is like diving at 130mph."