When thirds are not enough....

[Kevin Carlisle]

Middle Grounds/Crinoid Glory area. They also had a scooter failure during the dive, IIRC, tried to tow out but had issues with that. Yes, it was a complete CF of a dive. Poor gas planning, poor gas management (or no gas management), poor dive plan and execution.

I don't know what the gas plan was. I don't think they told anyone. But they basically went back to an area of the cave on scooter, kept the scooters with them, tried to push through a small passage that wouldn't be an issue in certain gear configurations, but they were backmount and pushing scooters ahead of them. Rather than turning around and heading back the way they came, they continued to push on through zero visibility. I'm sure there are marks all over the cave bottom where this happened if you want to find the area. They "thought" the gold line was on the other end of this small passage and it wasn't exactly there. It was during the zero visibility portion of the dive that they became separated. They spent time looking for the line and each other, eventually finding both. By that time they had already blown past their turn pressure. For some reason they chose to push their scooters out rather than leave them behind. They made it to the chimney, one made it to the top, the other was found on the bottom. The diver that found them was on a scooter, shared air with the diver at the top of the chimney and got him back to his deco cylinder then went back to find the other diver at the bottom of the chimney and did the same. That's pretty much all there is to it. At least what they admitted to.

They were in Sm Rob. One of them was making his 3rd or 4th dive in SM.

 

[ucfdiver]

They were in Sm Rob. One of them was making his 3rd or 4th dive in SM.

Well right there's your problem.

 

[Kevin Carlisle]

Well right there's your problem.

Yeah it one of them.. If we are talking about the 2 guys from Missouri that is. I was there when they went in but left to go home. I don't. Remember who said it but they were encouraged to scale back the dive to get accustomed to SM. Nice guys but that was stupid and almost killed them.

 

[DA Aquamaster]

They were in Sm Rob. One of them was making his 3rd or 4th dive in SM.

That's definitely an issue, if not the issue.

What bothers me about the growth in side mount is that some back mount cave divers seem to think you can just put the gear on and go dive - in a cave no less. Personally I put in a lot of OW dives before I ever entered a cave and then I was very conservative in terms of the cave diving I did until I got comfortabel and proficient in the configuration. That takes time even, with a SM course.

 

[ucfdiver]

That's definitely an issue, if not the issue.

What bothers me about the growth in side mount is that some back mount cave divers seem to think you can just put the gear on and go dive - in a cave no less. Personally I put in a lot of OW dives before I ever entered a cave and then I was very conservative in terms of the cave diving I did until I got comfortabel and proficient in the configuration. That takes time even, with a SM course.

Agreed. I'm seeing people with less than 50 cave dives beyond full cave making posts about messing around in silty SM tunnels.

It's pretty stupid/scary.

 

[Kevin Carlisle]

Agreed. I'm seeing people with less than 50 cave dives beyond full cave making posts about messing around in silty SM tunnels.

It's pretty stupid/scary.

It is very stupid, and with some of the new hotshots that are in a hurry I see more accidents coming. They need to learn that the cave is not going anywhere.

 

[Kevin Carlisle]

That's definitely an issue, if not the issue.

What bothers me about the growth in side mount is that some back mount cave divers seem to think you can just put the gear on and go dive - in a cave no less. Personally I put in a lot of OW dives before I ever entered a cave and then I was very conservative in terms of the cave diving I did until I got comfortabel and proficient in the configuration. That takes time even, with a SM course.

I was comfy from dive one but I knew there was all kinds of things to learn. I did 30 to 50 dives in big cave before I ever went into anything small. There is no reason not to slow down and live to dive nother day.

 

[Kevin Carlisle]

That's definitely an issue, if not the issue.

What bothers me about the growth in side mount is that some back mount cave divers seem to think you can just put the gear on and go dive - in a cave no less. Personally I put in a lot of OW dives before I ever entered a cave and then I was very conservative in terms of the cave diving I did until I got comfortabel and proficient in the configuration. That takes time even, with a SM course.

The sad part is he had his rig for a while. At least 2 trips down here. I saw the one guy get frustrated and swap back to BM instead of trying to learn how to dive SM on two occasions. The other guy had been in Sm few years, he should have known better also.

 

[SuPrBuGmAn]

Agreed. I'm seeing people with less than 50 cave dives beyond full cave making posts about messing around in silty SM tunnels.

It's pretty stupid/scary.

I nearly shat myself, thanks for that

 

[udtfire]

i agree a 1/3 is a min starting point