What's up with the Jet Fins?

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SeaJay

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Beaufort, SC, USA
Okay, here I am, going DIR and all... Lovin' life... Quit smoking, going veg, read the book, and took the class. I practice kicks often, even when I can't get in the water.

People accuse me of "drinking the Kool Aid," but if y'all will check the archives, I was very anti-DIR until very recently. I called them "Nazis," and was brutal with my opinions. No Nazi was gonna tell ME how to dive! :)

Opinonated, but not closed-minded, I read the book... And there was a lot of great stuff in there... And in many cases not at all the "style" that I was seeing here on Scubaboard. DIR-F, the book, showed logical thought processes and reasons for doing things that at first I discounted, but made sense the more I read.

...Still curious, I took the class and met some of these people. It's had a profound effect on my diving.

None of them, however, have ever requested that I "simply follow" some sort of docterine... Instead, they've encouraged me to ask and wonder and practice and experience and get "the real deal" on everything they preach. And much of it's been really great stuff.

I watched them dive, too... Man, I wanna be that good... Seriously! I was really impressed, and the way that they had a handle on their skills was simply amazing. Yes, I was "all ears."

...So now that it's come time to purchase some of my gear, I've decided on a very DIR-styled rig... And included in that is a set of Jet Fins that I got second hand, with the spring straps already in place. These were purchased and tried for about six dives by someone here on the board who is a very technical diver, an avid and regular diver, who decided that they simply weren't "for him." Cool. I got a deal!

Well, my new (okay, used by six times... They didn't even have a scratch on them) Jet Fins arrived the other day and I got the opportunity to try them out today.

For reference, I've been wearing a single pair of Mares Avanti Quattros for the past six years. I have never replaced any of the buckle and strap gear... Frankly, I think it's "bunk" to worry about those pieces...

I ordered the Jets because I wanted the better control that they offered to divers. The blades of the fins are simply larger, flatter, and stiffer than my long Quattros, and seemed to provide a better surface for doing mod frog kicks, helicopter turns, and backwards kicks. I was able to accomplish these things with my Quattros, but there was no doubt that it'd be better with the Jets...

I was impressed by the apparent durability of these fins. People say that they could easily survive a nuclear haulocaust... And I can attest that indeed, they appear to be that capable. Add the spring straps, and wow... We're talking a bulletproof fin here, which IMHO is great! And no wonder why DIR guys are so against ankle weights... These things weigh a ton all by themselves!

The problem is that they fit horrible. Putting them on is like putting a child's sand pail on your foot... With a board nailed to it. I'm not kidding! The foot pocket is apparently designed for a dry suit bootie, because my 3mm wetsuit booties fit terribly sloppily in there. Additionally, my toes were crammed into the end of the foot pocket, and yet the pocket only seemed to hold the latter half of my foot. In short, I felt like I was finning from my toes... Which did amazing things to cramp me horribly today and simultaneously provide no support by which to push that big, stiff fin around. What's worse are the spring straps... Where my Quattros have a nice, wide rubber strap on them, this fin had this 1/4" spring behind my foot, doing a nice job of digging into my achilles tendon. You would think that meant, then, that the spring straps were too tight... But no... In fact, the spring straps were not tight enough to hold the fin firmly on my foot! I found spring straps to be simultaneously too loose to effectively fin with, and too tight for comfort!

I switched back and forth between the two fins for two hours... No doubt, the Jets are much stiffer and much heavier, too (now I have to readjust my trim to get horizontal again, 'cause these things made my body try to trim vertically). A stiffer fin is more precise with it's energy transfer to the water, and I can see how that'd be an advantage, especially in exacting spaces like wrecks and caves. The shorter fin, too (they look waaaay shorter, but in fact are less than an inch shorter) would help me to keep better coordination with them. Of course, all of these good characteristics were nullified by the fact that my foot was swimmin' around in that foot pocket. It seemed very wide and not long enough; yet, I don't have an unusually narrow foot!

I even tried this one as well: I tried putting a Quattro on one foot, and a Jet on the other, and using them that way. I even switched feet, too, halfway through the dive to verify what I thought was going on. Simply put, the stiffer fin was able to transfer energy to the water better and consequently I would go around in a big circle toward the Quattro side, no matter what kick I used. However, that energy took a huge toll on my legs, and foot cramps and ankle strain were a direct result.

Later, as the tide was heading out, I actually got in the water in a whopping 4 knot current... The island has several docks on it, and so I wasn't worried about being swept away... I'd simply get out at the next dock. What I found was amazing...

Firstly, DIR-F taught me that a properly configured frog kick was not only more efficient than a flutter kick, but that a diver could go faster with a frog kick. Guys, I love you, and you've taught me a bunch of great stuff... But I'm going to have to call that one false. I found that the only way I could maintain position in that current was with a very fast and streamlined (read: from the hip, with no more than a 2' spread so as to stay in the slipstream) flutter kick. Yes, the frog is more efficient, and I'm sure it would be much better for silting. Stroke per stroke, there's no question that the frog's got it over the flutter. Unfortunately, the flutter's got two power strokes for every complete cycle of the fins... Up and then down... Both actions produce power. The frog kick is much more of a powerful kick, but only has one power stroke per cycle, and the cycles take longer to complete. Thus, I found that a well-executed flutter kick was simply more effective.

And I dive in currents all the time!

Now, why couldn't I do a well executed flutter with the Jets? Well, I could... Unfortunately, after 50 feet, I was completely pooped. They do not want to stay on my feet, and even if they did, they'd be doing it by my toes only. The spring straps allow for all kinds of slop, too. Now, if I could get them solidly mounted, then maybe that wouldn't be such a problem...

Of course, until you realize that the Jets are so wide that they tend to interfere with each other when fluttered.

My take on them? They make my bedroom closet stink like rubber. They're impossible to see underwater. They don't do anything for being able to identify your buddy (although yes, you could paint them, but why not just offer them in colors?) Rule #6 says, "Always look cool..." Well, guess what? I think they make me look like a Navy Seal. In some circles, that WOULD be cool... But not this one. I'm in this for the fun, and I wanna look like I'm having it! IMHO, the spring straps are simultaneously too loose and too tight, and they fit terribly on my feet. They give me cramps, too.

Switching over to my Quattros was a complete treat after those abusive things. The Quattros fit perfectly, and there is no slop whatsoever. In fact, I hardly know they're there until I push iwth them. Sure, they won't frog or helicopter as quick (because it's a narrow, long fin that resists the sideways movement more than the Jets) and they're longer and harder to keep coordination with because of a long, floppy end. They don't transfer energy as easy, either, but there's a positive in that... Like riding a bicycle in a lower gear, I find that I get more torque with less effort because I can paddle faster.

And most of all, I can really lay into the Quattros... When it comes time to battle a 4-knot current, I can just pump and go... I just can't do that with the Jets. They're sloppy and holding onto my feet by my toes, bending my ankles in such a way that full power is unbearable, and 3/4ths power is only half the speed of the Quattros... And not fast enough to combat this current.

These things caused me enough pain for the day. I personally think they make great rudders for a scooter, because of their stiffness... But would not want to dive these things on a regular basis. Perhaps they work great for ice diving or something... But they have no place here in sub-tropical water.

No thanks...

Anyone want to buy a set of Jets? Spring straps included... :D Oh yeah... Size XL (I wear a men's 11, and yes, these were sized correctly.)

You, too, can have a bucket and a board on your feet...
 
No, actually, every post you write, you say too much... I know exactly what you are talking about... I knew it right from the title of your post. Just use your quattros and be comfortable. I am also in the same boat as you, I have a slightly used pair of jet fins sitting under my bed right now. My problem was exactly opposite of yours: too small for my foot. Anyways, good luck!!!
 
"Size XL (I wear a men's 11, and yes, these were sized correctly.)"

Sounds like they don't fit. If they are too big for your feet, they are too big. Consider borrowing a small size to see if they work any better. You might also consider ditching the spring straps. I can't see any advantage to them.

"These things weigh a ton all by themselves!"

They are slightly negative in salt water. My 16 year old daughter who's 5' 4" with a slim build has no problems with the weight.

I'm impressed by anyone who can swim against a 4 knot current.
 
I wasn't ever anti-DIR, I just hadn't heard of it. When I did some research, I found that everything about it just made sense. Not in a creepy kind of cult way but in more of a high school math story problem kind of way.

Anyway back to the fins, that sounds like quite an experience there bud. I think I felt the same way though as far as the bucket and board feeling when I first got mine. It definetly took some getting used to. Once I did though, I didn't want to go back to my Tusa Imprex fins. I found that the Jets out powered any other fin I have ever used. Did you try using a thick hard soled boot or is it a softer sole? Sometimes you can take up the slack in the foot pocket that way.
I guess I got lucky on the fit though because my size ten foot fits in there perfectly with a 5mm boot. I made my spring straps myself though so I got the correct and comfortable sizing. Plus I saved some cash in the process.

So when you come down to FL to hit some wrecks with me bring your Quattro's and I will surely have my "sand pails with boards attached."
 
I think he's trying to say they don't fit him.
I could be wrong.

But since he always makes fun of my GREY uniform shirt, I had to rub it in that my Jets fit.:D
 
Yeah, Genesis and I are talking here and there about doing some wrecks on the Gulf. Interested?

Walter, it's not like I couldn't handle the weight... It's just that by comparison of the light and flickable fins I've been using, these things feel like trucks. No, make that "sand pails with boards nailed on." Yes, I would have to readjust my trim for them. Who wants to have to flick that much mass? It can be argued that one shouldn't be using a flutter at all, but I find it to be useful in some situations. I don't want a fin that does NOT allow me every fin kick possible... They all have their advantages!


I'm impressed by anyone who can swim against a 4 knot current.

Thanks, man! No smoking sure does it... And my body's thrilled to deliver now. I'm real happy about it...

Mind you, though, that I was freediving, so I had much less mass on me, although I was wearing my bp to fine tune fitment...

...And it's not like I had to swim far... I didn't have to keep it up indefinitely.

Yeah, 4 knots is just about as fast as I can push any fin... No way a frog was going to accomplish that...

I keep wondering why my buddies are so concerned about the tides when we dive... They always want to do it on slack tide... Why is it that I don't seem to care and they do?
 
SCORE ResQ once bubbled...


But since he always makes fun of my GREY uniform shirt, I had to rub it in that my Jets fit.:D

Hahahhaaa!!! You're right, man... I'm sorry I called it "lavender." I think it's closer to "grape." :D

Okay, I just put on a bootie and put the Jets back on to try to figure this out...

Here's what I've got...

It's not that the pocket's too big... It's that it's too small. See, it fits nicely right now with my 3mm "sock" tropical bootie, but the problem is that the bottom of the fin only comes up to my arch. Does that make sense? The "edges" of the "bucket" only swallow my foot up to about midway through the arch of my foot.

...So I think what I would need is a bootie that's got a real sole on it... A "sneaker-like" bootie with it's own arch support in it. Of course, then I'd have to have a larger fin, and Jets don't come any larger... So it'd be the Turtles.

Now, after all of that, the "edge" of the "bucket" would still only come up to the center of my arch, but on an upstroke the heavier sole would keep the bucket edge from falling into that part of my foot... Thereby fixing the problem of the fin feeling only like it's on the tip of my toes... And probably simultaneously fixing the "slop" problem that I'm feeling.

The Quattros don't have this problem, as their foot pocket is very soft and designed to mold nicely around the diver's foot... All the way to the diver's heel.
 
Maybe a stiffer soled boot is the answer. I took a pic of my hard soled 5mm boot with one fin on. Is that what you're talking about only coming up to the arch of your foot? With my hard soled boot, the "edge of the bucket" doesn't fold in on my foot giving that sloppy feeling you're talking about. Try a different boot and if it doesn't fit, you may have to go with the Turtles with a Rcokboot.:D
 
that I found with this problem, but then again I don't go analysing peoples fin problems on a regular basis. Seriously though, I love the fins but the foot pocket must slide all the way over your foot. These fins provide a lot of force and are great, but you basically cannot use them correctly if they are only sliding on 1/2 way. sounds like your foot configuration is not compatible with the jets, better send them to ebay. I would think maybe its the altered straps but you say they just will not go on all the way, that's not a strap problem. sounds like they are useless for you.

I'm not fond of the turtles. Good luck not smoking, one less Emphysema patient for the hospitals when you turn 70ish (throat cancer and the rest of it). Great Job! I'm sure its tough but you will be thanking yourself for it in the later years even more...
 
https://www.shearwater.com/products/swift/

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