What would you do??

[Frosty]

Actually I have to say I have seen a LOT of dive op's in the pacific that set up your gear for you before you get on board the boat.
Im one of the guys that does the setting up for you.
Why? a couple of reasons actually.
Space on the boat whilst heading out on an RIB or small boat is restricted. The skipper needs the gear tied up so its not heading over the side.
Equally a diver fiddling with their gear isn;t holding on or watching out for waves etc.
Time is money so less time fiddling once at the dive site means the 3 or 4 dive day doesn't snowball away to a 6pm finish.
Lastly--This conversation is being had with dive addicts mostly but on a dive boat you have a real mixture of experience levels.
So its safer to work on lowest common denominator and set the gear up for people.

Ohh and to answer the question. I would say to the diver to sit right next to me and copy me.-if we have time Id strip their gear back down and go through it again with them. I'd be quizzing them on their weight needs to see if they know it. If not Id be helping them into the water to do a predive weight check. I'd also offer to do a checkout dive with them if they wanted. Heck we all make mistakes and we were all inexperienced divers once.

 

[CuzzA]

First, the captain must be made aware of the liability not only for the potential repercussions of the diver having an accident, but also for the safety of the other divers (myself included) and crew. Period. If I'm the captain of the ship, I demand to know what's going on.

At the end of the day, whether you offer advice or not to the liability diver, the captain and/or crew needs to know the guy doesn't know how to suit up. As mentioned, if he can't put his gear together, it's safe to assume he doesn't know how to dive and someone (other than me) needs to babysit him or he sits out.

If it were on my boat, he/she sits.

 

[TMHeimer]

First, the captain must be made aware of the liability not only for the potential repercussions of the diver having an accident, but also for the safety of the other divers (myself included) and crew. Period. If I'm the captain of the ship, I demand to know what's going on.

At the end of the day, whether you offer advice or not to the liability diver, the captain and/or crew needs to know the guy doesn't know how to suit up. As mentioned, if he can't put his gear together, it's safe to assume he doesn't know how to dive and someone (other than me) needs to babysit him or he sits out.

If it were on my boat, he/she sits.

Can't argue with any of that.

Agree also with DevonD in that no one should have to act in their professional role while on their own trip as a paying customer.

Frosty: Makes great sense to have all gear assembled before leaving the dock. Less going on at/near the dive site. I haven't seen it done in the US/Canada, but would be a good change. Perhaps why it isn't done is because with all that integrated weight the units would be real heavy to then load to the boat? As far as helping someone gear up, copying you, weight check, checkout dive, etc., you are talking as a DM. The question is what do you do if you are a customer and this diver is your buddy.

I must digress back to Insta-Gator's "laughing" comment. I know SB posters tend to be way deeper into diving than many others but, seriously, can you believe anyone would actually sign up for a dive charter without knowing how to assemble the unit? Akin to those that sign up for OW course and literally can't swim. Some things I will never understand.

 

[Frosty]

TMheimer-I guess because the question was asked what would YOU do I answered as ME.
To be honest though if I downgrade to say rescue diver I would have and HAVE followed the same principle. Id still offer to show them through the setup and offer to do a weight check with them but might pass the weight check over to the DM/instructor.
In my experience forgetting how to set gear up isn't indicative of a bad or even a sloppy diver.

 

[jhh]

I must digress back to Insta-Gator's "laughing" comment. I know SB posters tend to be way deeper into diving than many others but, seriously, can you believe anyone would actually sign up for a dive charter without knowing how to assemble the unit? Akin to those that sign up for OW course and literally can't swim. Some things I will never understand.

Yes. One time in particular strikes me as memorable: A guy in backplate and wing and seemingly well configured high end tech gear was on a Blackbeard's trip. He's really tall and skinny and would probably sink like a rock, and it's June so he has no wetsuit and just a rashguard. He asks me for some four pound weights, and I look at his lead festooned belt. I think he said it was 24 pounds he had on it. The 7 foot hose not tucked and looped was just icing on the cake when it was snagging all over everything.

 

[Steve_C]

seriously, can you believe anyone would actually sign up for a dive charter without knowing how to assemble the unit?

Seen it more than once. Diver gets certified. Maybe even trained right. Then no local diving and 3 or even 6 months later they are on the boat all ready for that first ocean reef dive and suddenly realize they have have not set up their gear in six months and then it was only over a few class dives. Been the instabuddy more than once in this situation. I will add that all the true novices like this were female, listened to my polite suggestions, and once in the water and relaxed made pretty decent buddies. They stayed close and being a petite woman the air consumption was not bad.

Now the guys that brag about all the diving they have done, but it was several years ago. Those have sometimes gone less well. One I had to stop a full panic when his mask flooded. Another could not get under the water. He was not so bad. It was a very shallow reef dive. I did my dive at 20 ft. He followed along on the surface (his choice). Basically my buddy was a snorkeler. So I soloed and played life guard for him. A third told me he was trying to improve his SAC by holding his breath as long as he could between inhales. That one we had the that could kill you talk.

 

[TMHeimer]

TMheimer-I guess because the question was asked what would YOU do I answered as ME.
To be honest though if I downgrade to say rescue diver I would have and HAVE followed the same principle. Id still offer to show them through the setup and offer to do a weight check with them but might pass the weight check over to the DM/instructor.
In my experience forgetting how to set gear up isn't indicative of a bad or even a sloppy diver.

OK, I may have interpreted the question incorrectly. Agree that forgetting how to set it up doesn't mean you are a bad/sloppy diver. Getting on a boat that may drop you into 80' of water without first re-figuring out how to do it makes you bad and sloppy.

Steve_C, Oh I believe you for sure about people getting certified, doing nothing for 6 months, then hopping on a boat. My amazement is that this does happen--apparently all the time. I guess if you don't own your own equipment right away you have nothing to practise with for those 6 months. Well, maybe a refresher before the boat trip. I bought mine right away, and did dive #1 two months later when arrived in FL. I must've practised putting it together (can't recall now), as I do recall having no problems at the site. Maybe if one doesn't own equipment it would be good to google how to assemble it during the 6 months. I don't know. No matter, amazing.

The two hardest things for me in OW course was the removal/replacement of unit skill and assembling/disassembling the unit. If a dope like me could do it on his first post OW dive without help........

 

[AdivingBel]

I guess it's a matter of degree. I've never seen anyone drag all their stuff out of their bag and go "Duh, how does this go together." It's usually "I can't remember if the guages go on the right or left." They might have trouble getting their weight pockets secured or god forbid, try to string a weight belt. I've seen folks hook up the reg then start undoing the cam bands to attach the BCD. Man, if you sit there and watch them unthread a cam band, well you're just evil.:devil3: I can't help but to help out with that kind of stuff if they are struggling and they ask. We're all human.

 

[Centrals]

They are vacation divers so please give them a break! Help them if you like and there is no point to look down at them. How difficult it is to help the poor guy to set up his equipment? Some peoples are very timid to ask for opinion.
A condescending attitude is pathetic.

 

[fisheater]

Sadly, I expect this from most vacation-only, warm water divers.

Just make sure that the DM does check the gear and know that you've diving with folks who are not as experienced or serious as you.