what makes a diving agency a diving agency?

[OldNSalty]

I get that-but if I show up with no card or a card that you have never seen before....do you guys have to check a list to see if it is 'approaved' before letting me take a class or, if I do OK on hte checkout dives do the instructors have the final say?

 

[boulderjohn]

So what are you instructors required to recognize as I would think that one key to "accredited agency" would be if it is recognized by a lot of other agencies?

So if I show up with an open water card and tell you I want to take an advance class, is there a list of agencies that you accept? If it is an agency you have never heard of is that OK?

If it is an agency I have never heard of, I will check it out first. There are lots of places to get a list of agencies. Within that list are a number of names that I would recognize, and I would have to investigate those I do not recognize. I would hope, for example, that if I (or more likely the person working the counter at the shop) would check if you came in with a card from Scuba Divers of America and would recognize that it is not a real agency. Even then, there would have to be some judgment. What makes SDA a bogus agency? Is it just the fact that it consists of one person and its home address is a vacant lot? Is that enough to disqualify it? Is the warning on the PADI site that it is not a legitimate agency and PADI does not recognize its training enough to disqualify it? In that case, yes, but it is the only agency so named on the PADI site, and that is because so many people have been scammed by SDA's continued statement on its various web sites that its training is recognized by all agencies, including PADI.

I would say that the odds of someone coming in with a truly bogus OW card are so very small that most people have probably not given much thought to what they would do. You have to wonder why someone would have a bogus card--there is not much incentive to get one. Real cards are not that expensive or hard to get. In the case of SDA, the person who runs it was expelled from NAUI for some unexplained reason, and I suspect that reason would be explained in case he attempted to cross over to another agency, hence the need to create his own.

 

[OldNSalty]

I guess the example is getting in the way of the point. I am suggesting that what makes a diving agency a diving agency is if it is recognized as such but other agencies or professionals in the field. If Harvard had no accredidation but their undergrad degree was acceptable to get into grad school at any program in the country...well....that's a real college IMO.

So it sounds like PADI is basically saying anyone but SDA is OK? Honestly, that is kinda the response I expected...that if the instructor is OK with the student's level of skill then you can take them. Is that about right?

 

[The Chairman]

If it is an agency I have never heard of, I will check it out first.

Not me. I always assume the worst when it comes to trim and buoyancy and I am rarely disappointed. A lot of my AOWs are in reality bringing students up to my OW standards. I have found that even a few of my past students have let their skills slip so I can't just fault the OI (Original Instructor). All the OW card tells me is that they have put some effort into learning Scuba so far and I am way OK with that.

 

[Thalassamania]

I get that-but if I show up with no card or a card that you have never seen before....do you guys have to check a list to see if it is 'approaved' before letting me take a class or, if I do OK on hte checkout dives do the instructors have the final say?

I guess the example is getting in the way of the point. I am suggesting that what makes a diving agency a diving agency is if it is recognized as such but other agencies or professionals in the field. If Harvard had no accredidation but their undergrad degree was acceptable to get into grad school at any program in the country...well....that's a real college IMO.

So it sounds like PADI is basically saying anyone but SDA is OK? Honestly, that is kinda the response I expected...that if the instructor is OK with the student's level of skill then you can take them. Is that about right?

All to often the "approval" of one training agency vs. another has more to do with competitive games and marketing than it does with actual appraisal of training that occurred.

 

[The Chairman]

All to often the "approval" of one training agency vs. another has more to do with competitive games and marketing than it does with actual appraisal of training that occurred.

As does the disapproval!

 

[boulderjohn]

Upon further reflection, I would not be all that interested in the agency a diver came from if coming to me for an AOW. (I have so far never done an AOW class with any students outside of the most well known agencies.) The point is to start with the student wherever that student may be and then make progress to where the student needs to be. The capital letters on the OW card aren't that important.

The only reason that PADI specifically mentions SDA is because the SDA web site specifically says that its materials are recognized by all scuba agencies, and students have thrown a fit when they go to a PADI agency and find that they are not. The specific problem is that they claim that their OW academic materials will be accepted by all agencies in lieu of the agencies' academic materials, thus saving the students that cost.

 

[FM1520]

I'll accept any and every agency's cards as proof of prior dive instruction. Why subject your clients or prospective clients to any undue pettiness on your part? It's just not professional to draw that kind of line in the sand.

Well said and this should be the standard.

 

[paolov]

During DEMA, registered participants vote for people they choose to be on the panel of members that would select the final composition of the DIVE CONGRESS Representatives that then would have to have representatives from the following sectors(worldwide)

1. training entities (avoided "agency" ),
2. academe,
3. dive professionals,
4.medical field (doctors, emt, deco chamber staff, etc)
5.OEM,
6. dive operators (representatives from operators of resorts, boats, resort employees, boat crew, etc)
7. allied dive industries such as vehicle transport, airlines, local dive communities etc
8. Coast guard
9. local conservation ngo
10. dive groups/clubs
11. etc.

the committe has the follwing tasks to reco on every DEMA.

1. Recommended Minimum Safety requirements for recreational diving and progression skills on equipment use
2. reco safe diving practices/procedures

 

[The Chairman]

Are you suggesting this, or do you think it actually exists?