What ever happened to RESPECT

[H2Andy]

i want to say that i appreciate and respect those who have disagreed with me
but have respected my right to disagree and have not made personal attacks.

those of you who have, it's easy to show respect for those who agree with you.
the true measure of respect is when you can extend it to those who disagree
with you.

let's ponder on that and the meaning of this thread

 

[Potapko]

That's funny, true disciples "interpret" it much the same way.

I beg to differ. God has done his best work through IMPERFECT humans. Only God is perfect, and I would hope that you at least accept that your understanding of the scriptures may be less than perfect. If not, than there is no reason to continue a dialogue with an unreasonable person.
".

My understanding is always open to revision. I have no "corner on the truth. I am not the one who said and I quote again" A better translation would be"
There is no better translation. The Bible is perfect as written. God promised to preserve His Word. He has elevated His Word above His Name. Ps 138:2, Ps 12:6-7 Our understanding may not always be perfect, but it is, lets be clear.

 

[bwerb]

Sigh...dude...sorry...you are wrong. I've said it...you are wrong.

The Bible IS a translation (unless you somehow think that it was written in English and only ONE of the multitude of versions is somehow the correct one).

That is not to say that the message is different, it isn't but...the translations which we make emphasize or highlight specific nuances of the words. We have only one word for LOVE in English. In Greek there are at least 4...guess what...the "translation" to LOVE is incomplete...only by looking at the original languages can we be on solid ground in our "interpretations" of the meanings of words and verses. We also need to ensure that we are reading it with correct historical understanding...ie, the context is key.

I'm sorry again but your statement that there is only one translation is wrong.

 

[Potapko]

Sigh...dude...sorry...you are wrong. I've said it...you are wrong.

The Bible IS a translation (unless you somehow think that it was written in English and only ONE of the multitude of versions is somehow the correct one).

That is not to say that the message is different, it isn't but...the translations which we make emphasize or highlight specific nuances of the words. We have only one word for LOVE in English. In Greek there are at least 4...guess what...the "translation" to LOVE is incomplete...only by looking at the original languages can we be on solid ground in our "interpretations" of the meanings of words and verses. We also need to ensure that we are reading it with correct historical understanding...ie, the context is key.

I'm sorry again but your statement that there is only one translation is wrong.

That takes a lot of study and wisdom to declare me "wrong" on something I didn't even say. I will say it though. There is and can be only one perfect translation in any one language.

Since you have declared me wrong, please teach us where God's preserved Word is? He promised to give it without error. 1 Tim 3:15-16, promised to preserve it without error, Ps 12:6-7. Told us to live by every Word of it, Luke 4:4.

Help me out here with a lesson. Please don't say, in the originals, because they don't exist. If you want to claim in the original languages, please tell me where to get a copy and which text to buy? Textus receptus, vaticanus, Sainaticus (sp) Aleph A,B, or C?
I like to learn
One thing you can convict me as guilty of. I believe the King James Bible is the preserved Word of God in the English language. Perfect and without error or proven contradiction.

There, some real amunition for you

 

[medic_diver45]

As for the translation comment, AMEN! It seems that a lot of people have forgotten that Jesus didn't speak English (English in any form we would recognize or understand has only been around for a few hundred years). There's a famous quote from the former director of the Texas Board of Education that is often quoted when debates about foreign language education come up, to show how ignorant people can be: "If English was good enough for Jesus, then it's good enough for Texas."

I think this debate is starting to slip and become seriously in danger of slipping into territories where we should not tread....we gotten to the point where we're debating translations of holy texts...that's one step away from degrading to name calling and personal attacks about one's belief system. Let's either reign in this debate back to what it was supposed to be about (RESPECT) or agree to disagree and amicably end this thread.

As for correct translation into a given language, that depends on when the translation was done (language changes over time), who did it (whether they had some sort of agenda) and whether you agree with their views.


JMHO

-Steve

 

[MXGratefulDiver]

Good call Steve ... I'm watching this thread start to slip down a slope it shouldn't go. Let's try to get it back on topic ... and remember what the topic was supposed to be about.

... Bob (Grateful Diver)

 

[H2Andy]

One thing you can convict me as guilty of. I believe the King James Bible is
the preserved Word of God in the English language. Perfect and without error or proven contradiction.

this is not a Biblical teaching. nowhere in the Bible does it
say that the King James Bible is the preserved Word of God
in the English language.

since you have strayed from Biblical teaching, you are
in error by your own logic, my friend.

with all due respect

i must say that i love the King James, btw. i hate the
new translations. miss all the poetry.

 

[bwerb]

I agree Steve...back to work for a bit...I'll PM my response to TDP in a while...let me know if you are interested and I'll PM anyone else as well...

 

[medic_diver45]

Oh and by the way in regards to the "secular American smokescreen", despite the fact that most of us here in the US seem to have forgotten it, but we are technically supposed to be a secular state (the whole "seperation of church and state" clause).

 

[medic_diver45]

Hmm....if we're taking it literally, then technically (and please don't call me on this as though I believe these things (I DON'T): I'm just trying to make a point):

TWO EXAMPLES (I KNOW OF MORE, BUT THESE SHOW MY POINT QUITE WELL)
-Gays and lesbians should be killed (Leviticus 20:13)
-Adulterous spouses (and the people they cheat with) should be killed (Leviticus 20:10)
**OH AND BY THE WAY I LIKE THE WAY THE VERSES POINT OUT THAT IT'S THE PEOPLE WHO ARE BEING KILLED'S FAULT THEY ARE BEING KILLED ("Their blood shall be upon them"- apparently is only a sin when you kill someone who doesn't agree with you) I know these are both Old Testament quotes, and it goes on later in the New Testament to contradict these teachings, but the question becomes then: IF THEY ARE BOTH THE WORD OF GOD AND HE IS PERFECT, WHY DID HE CHANGE HIS MIND ON KILLING? You go from "you're wicked or perverse, you must die" to "He who's has not send shall cast the first stone". You see my point? The Bible flip-flops and waffles more than John Kerry (I'm a Democrat by the way, albeit a conservative one) during an election year.