weight question

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RalphDog

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Here's what I know:

In the pool, with no wetsuit, I need 8 pounds on my belt.

In the pool, with my new 3 mil wetsuit, I need 18 pounds (I think, at practice last week I didn't have the chance to try less, I think I might have been over-weighted).

What's a good guess as to what I'll need with the same equipment in salt water? What should I ask the DM to give me to start with?

Suggestions appreciated.

- Don
 
Ralph...You should be able to do a weight check in the water before your dives. You don't say where you'll be diving, whether it will be shore or boat dives. When you sign in, just tell the DM you want to do a weight check.

Someone can probably give you a mathematical formula for figuring your salt weight but I usually add #6 for salt water.
 
Hi Don and welcome to the board.

I wish there was a good foolproof way to figure out the weight you need before a dive but I don't know of one (at least not for the first few dive trips). Your 18 lbs seems a bit much to me, I use about 16 lbs with a 2 piece 7mm in saltwater (10 lbs in saltwater with no wetsuit) but weight requirements vary greatly and depend a lot on your body makeup, equipment and experience. The best thing you can do is to do an in-water buoyancy check before your first dive. Be sure to take into account the 4 or 5lbs of positivive buoyancy that you are going to have at the end of the dive due to the loss of air in the tank. Or in other words, get your weight perfect and ADD 4 or 5 more pounds. I would also do the check again at the end of the dive and adjust as necessary. I do a weight check every spring and at any chance I get. Here is the trick to getting it perfect every time (after a few dives that is)...WRITE IT DOWN IN YOUR LOG. I have a log of almost every dive that I have made and they all include the exact equipment, weight, water conditions and how I felt about my buoyancy. The next time I have a similar dive, I look throught the log and find a similar one...and the exact weight I need.
 
Dee and all -

An extra six pounds sounds manageable. I am still shuddering from my OW cert in Lake Huron (Georgian Bay), wearing a 7mil farmer john and jacket, hood and gloves and -- need i say I'm a big person? -- 40 pounds of lead around my waist. Actually, if the weight belt had stayed around my waist that would have been fine, but it was not fun to feel the damn thing slip down past my non-existant butt and snag on my my ankles and fins -- not once but twice.

Now with my own integrated BC, some pool time playing with it, and the prospect of diving with less than half that weight, I am optimistic that the experience will be more enjoyable.

My life lesson learned from the 40-pound slippage episode: it is far, far easier to re-don a heavy weight belt when 20 feet under and able to gently twist and spin than trying to do the same on the surface, with a very full BC, in the chop and wind.

Learning is fun.

- Don
 
First, WELCOME from Sunny Florida (GO Gators) to the finest board, SCUBA or otherwise on the net. I hope that you have as much fun and meet as many fine people as I have.

Second, thats why I dive a steel HP PST 120. I need no weight with my3/5 and 2 lbs with my 5 mil Henderson Farmer John and Jacket. In salt water, I will go to eight pounds depending on my thermal protection. Also being the proud founder of the BOD Squad, (Big Overweight Diver) I tend to suck down air. I do not mind slowing my body down, but I can not tolerate the head ache from shallow or skip breathing.

:tease:
 
I posted this earlier on a different forum but Ill post it here for you as well..

Here is some info i thought id pass along:


Step One: Calculate for your body (Typical range 1- 10lbs)

How much weight would you need to make your body alone neutral? There are two methods, one pretty accurate, the other a guesstimate.

Method 1: Take a few weights to a swimming pool. You will be perfectly weighted when you can hang motionless with half a breath and sing when you exhale. Using snorkel can make this easier. Assuming this is a freshwater pool, you can then make the saltwater conversion below. Remember to correct your total weight, body plus lead.

Method 2: Most lean adults are 1 to 4 pounds positive, although musclar, big-boned divers may be a few pounds negative. Remeber your weight when you were in your best physical condition as an adult? How much have you gained since then? How much of the gain is fat? For ever 10 pounds of fat you've gained add two pounds of lead. For ever 10 pounds of muscle , subtract 1 pound of lead.

Step Two: Calculate for your tank (Typical Range -7 to +5lbs)

Buoyancy characteristics of tanks vary. Find your tank below. Using the tanks weight when empty, add lead for positively buoyant tanks, subtract it for negative ones.

Step Three: Calculate for your exposure suit (Typical Range 2 to 20lbs)

There are several methods to estimate how much weight you'll need to compensate for the buoyancy of your weightsuit. Remember, its the buoyancy in shallow water (at your safety stop) that counts. Shell drysuits with full-thickness underwear normally require a few pounds more then a 7mm weightsuit.

Method 1: Take it to a swimming pool. Wearing your exposure suit and weight belt, figure your buoyancy as above in step one.

Method 2: Weigh it. Neoprene is 2 to 3 pounds buoyant for every pound it weighs in air, depending on the quality of the neoprene and age of the suit. (1mm neoprene skins, being proportionally more nylon, are less buoyant)

Method 3: How thick is it? A mans large fullsuit has 2 to 3 pounds of buoyancy per millimeter of thickness (a 3mm fullsuit has about 6 to 9 pounds of buoyancy; a 7mm fullsuit about 14 to 20 pounds). If you wear a differnt size, estimate an adjustment. Keep in mind that thinner suits and neoprene skins will have less buoyancy.

Step Four: Calculate for other gear (Typical Range 2 to 4lbs)

Regulators, gauges, knives, most fins and BCs are slightly negative. The total of your mandatory gear is probably 2 to 4 pounds. Optional equipment can change the equation by a pound or so. Most large lights are slightly negative. Cameras may be either negative or positive by about 1 pound.

Step Five: Total it up (Typical Range 2 to 40lbs)

This is your target weight and should be accurate to within 4 or 5 pounds.


Freshwater/Saltwater Conversion:

By how much do you have to change your weight belt when going from fresh to saltwater? To be accurate, you have to consider the whole package: diver plus equipment.

Stand on the bathroom scale with the equipment and weight that makes you neutral in one medium or other. Or you can estimate. A stand aluminum 80 tank weighs 32 pounds, a 7mm wetsuit is about 8 pounds. For regulator, mask, fins, etc, figure about 15 pounds. Include your weights.

Going from fresh to salt.. multiply by 0.025 and add that amount.

Going from salt water to fresh water.. multiply the total by 0.025 and subtract that amount from your weight belt or integrated-weight BC.

Tank Table: The Weight of Air

Type of Tank Full Empty Change
aluminum 50 @ 3000 psi -3.0 +1.0 +4.0
aluminum 63 @ 3000 psi -2.0 +3.0 +5.0
aluminum 67 @ 3000 psi -5.0 +0.5 +5.5
Steel 72 @ 2475 psi -5.0 +0.5 +5.5
Steel 76 @ 2640 psi -6.0 0.0 +6.0
aluminum 80 @ 3000 psi -2.0 +4.5 +6.5
aluminum 80 @ 3000 psi* -4.0 +2.5 +6.5
Steel 95 @ 3300 psi -15.0 -7.5 +7.5
Steel 95 @ 2640 psi -7.5 0.0 +7.5

* Super 80

This data is based on actual test and differs from mfg. specs, mfgs calculate specs for an ideal tank in fresh water with no valve.

:jester:
 
In a pool, I take each piece of gear I buy and find out how much weight it takes to sink it. Nothing fancy, for a wetsuit, for example, I put weights on it until it just goes under. For something that sinks, I use a balance hung from the diving board - on one end I hang the item, on the other I have a bag into which I put weights until they balance (both item and weight bag are under water).
In my logbook I have a list of how much weight I have to add to sink each item - or how much weight I can remove for each item that sinks - I just add all the stuff I'm going to wear for a dive up and voila - there's the perfect weight for fresh water.
The actual formula for going from fresh to salt depends on which ocean you're going to, as salt water varies in density from place to place, but for most tropical oceans, it is just as rstone says:
Take your *total* weight - you, wetsuit, tank, weights, camera, lights... the whole thing. Now, add 2.5 (really 2.4, but that's too hard to measure) pounds per 100 pounds you weigh, and you'll be just right.
The reason this works is because you displace the same volume of water whether you're diving fresh or salt, and your typical salt water weighs right at 102.4% per unit volume of fresh water - so you displace 102.4% and you need to weigh 102.4% to remain neutral.
Rick
 
Also when your figuring this all out dont forget to account for the change in tank unless you dive with a neutral tank or your tank is always negative. If you dont you will have alot of fun at the end of your dive trying to stay at 15ft for your safety stop.
 
If you know your correct weighting for fresh water, get completely geared up and step on a scale (you need to be dry for this to work).

Multiply the weight shown on the scale by .025 and that's how much you need to add. Then fudge and add a couple more pounds, because though this is the correct formula, it never seems to work out exactly because we're living beings, not inanimate chunks of matter. :)

How does this work?

If you know your correct weighting, by stepping on a scale fully geared up (and dry) you’ll show exactly how much fresh water (in weight, and indirectly volume) you’re displacing (if you’re neutral your weight is equal to the weight of the water displaced). Salt water is denser than fresh water; in fact it’s about 1.025 times as dense, so though you’ll displace the same volume of salt water (unless you change equipment), it’s heavier so you need more weight.

So the obvious approach is to multiply the weight shown on the scale by 1.025 then subtract your original weight, but you can factor it out to be:

(weight_on_scale * 1.025) – weight_on_scale = weight_to_add

or

weight_on_scale * (1.025 – 1) = weight_to_add

or

weight_on_scale * 0.025 = weight_to_add

So, for example, if fully geared up (with everything, including weight belt) I weigh 240 pounds dry, then for salt water I'd need to add 240 * 0.025 = 6 pounds.

Have fun!

Roak
 
Originally posted by rstone
Also when your figuring this all out dont forget to account for the change in tank unless you dive with a neutral tank or your tank is always negative. If you dont you will have alot of fun at the end of your dive trying to stay at 15ft for your safety stop.
True - when using my pool method I weigh/sink the various tanks with 500psi in them vice full.
Rick
 
https://www.shearwater.com/products/teric/

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