Warped Dive World Evolution - BP/W Subgroup Mindset

[MXGratefulDiver]

I haven't gotten squat from Halcyon, but I got some free stickers from Dive Rite. Big commission there.

Have you replaced that SS1 contraption back to Halcyon's OEM inflator yet?

Putting an SS1 on a Halcyon rig is like putting a gun rack on a Volvo ...

... Bob (Grateful Diver)

 

[Scott L]

Putting an SS1 on a Halcyon rig is like putting a gun rack on a Volvo ...

... Bob (Grateful Diver)

fnfalman, post that photo. Were just having fun (TGIF).

 

[fxrguy]

Well I'm just getting back into diving after a few years hiatus and have chosen to go the bp/w route mainly because I used to dive for years (1978-2000) with an old Seapro At-Pac. This was one of the precursors to the modern bp/w configurations. It had a hollow plastic backpack that was filled with lead shot to your desired weight and then the excess area was filled with marbles. There was a quick release latch on the bottom of the pack so you could dump your weights. Originally had only a hog harness which I loved but later "upgraded' to a comfort jacket that laced right on to the backplate. I hated the comfort jacket! I came upon this rig back in 78 used completely by accident as I had just got certified and wanted my own gear. I couldn't afford new stuff so I jumped at the chance to get this stuff. It was 6 or 7 years old when I bought it. I used it for so many years because it was modular and I could replace anything that wore out. Today I want that stream lined feeling I had with my old rig without the comfort jacket. Just want the hog harness again. I also just absolutely loved the trim I could achieve with the weights on my back rather then on my hips or waist. A lot of the people I used to dive with back in the day thought the At-Pac looked uncomfortable until I let them use it. Not everybody liked it but it won over more jacket style converts then it didn't. Back in those days you almost never saw another A-Pac because the industry was so dominated by manufacturers of jacket style BC's. They had successfully demonized the At-Pacs to the point that I think half the people I dove with that didn't know any better probably thought I'd be lucky if I made it back to the boat alive...LOL. You know the old "face down in the water at the surface" routine. I would have thought that old worn out line would have died out years ago but I'm still running into it every now and then. You would do yourself a favor to remember that most of that kind of BS is just marketing. How many people have you heard of that drowned at the surface because their BC held them face down? Jeez, I've been diving for 33 years and haven't heard of one yet. I'm sure though that when a diver does drown wearing a bp/w, they will be demonized yet again. I doubt that anyone who claims bp/w are dangerous wants to to a head count of diving fatalities just to see what bc they were using! Anyway, it's good to see bp/w systems getting the attention these days that I think they deserve. I'm not militant about using them and I would never criticize someone else's rig. I just ask the same courtesy from other divers that choose another style of bc. I'm just out there to have a good time and not have to explain myself. I have to admit though that I have always enjoyed seeing people's attitudes change that were so adamant about jacket bc's and bought into the "face down on the surface" propaganda. Hey, we are all out there just to get wet and have a good time right? Please don't criticize my bc and I won't go off on telling you how great I think it is. I mean getting wet is what it's all about right? No really I'm talken about scuba...:wink1:

A little follow up on this post. After I put the "comfort" jacket on the At-Pac and started using integrated weights in the comber-bun pockets it screwed everything up. The jacket was so buoyant I had to really increase the amount of weight I needed and sometimes I even had to use a weight belt. I also had really bad rolling problems. I don't know a whole lot about jacket type BC's but I do know what I like when I'm in the water. God speed to all you jacket users but it's gonna be a BP/W for this guy!

 

[Tortuga68]

I don't know a whole lot about jacket type BC's but I do know what I like when I'm in the water. God speed to all you jacket users but it's gonna be a BP/W for this guy!

Your cheque is in the mail

 

[Amphiprion]

My eyes hurt from reading so many posts.

Tell me if I have this correct:
1. OP says most OW divers and most LDS sell and rent mostly non bp/w type bcs.
2. Scuba magazines and LDS generally promote non bp/w type bcs.
3. Retail scuba industry is geared towards promotion and sale of non bp/w type bcs.
4. Many scubaboard posters provide an alternative to the retail scuba industry and promote bp/w instead.
5. Many scubaboard posters say that the bp/w is less bulky, more streamlined, has better trim, better weighting, better venting than non bp/w and tell this to new divers.
6. OP is irritated that many scubaboard posters provide anecdotal evidence of this nature to support their contentions.
7. OP doesn't like many scubaboard posters do this even though the retail scuba industry does this for their equipment.
8. This thread has established that non bp/w bcs do not work in every situation, such as tech diving, but are suitable for most applications.
9. This thread (presumably) has established that bp/w bcs work in every situation provided that you are not using a seven pound backplate when traveling light or a doubles wing when using a single AL80.
10. Jackets are not the sign of an inexperienced diver.
11. BP/W does not make a person a good diver.

What is wrong with posters on scubaboard promoting an alternative viewpoint from their own experience compared to the retail dive industry?

 

[cool_hardware52]

What is wrong with posters on scubaboard promoting an alternative viewpoint from their own experience compared to the retail dive industry?

Absolutely nothing,


(unless you are Halemano, then saving the masses from the evils of anecdotal first hand accounts is apparently what gives life meaning.)

Tobin

 

[MauiScubaSteve]

I have never, ever, made a deal over someone's anecdotal opinion, much less a big deal.

I have pointed out that zealous, sloppy typists often type in a way that makes their anecdotal opinion look like fact.

I have also pointed out when opinionated people make absolute statements of fact that are unsupported ignorance.

BP/W's are more streamlined than Vest BC's

and

BP/W's vent easier than Vest BC's

are both

UNSUPPORTED IGNORANCE !!!

"Qualifiers" keep one from spewing unsupported ignorance!

 

[fxrguy]

My eyes hurt from reading so many posts.

Tell me if I have this correct:
1. OP says most OW divers and most LDS sell and rent mostly non bp/w type bcs.
2. Scuba magazines and LDS generally promote non bp/w type bcs.
3. Retail scuba industry is geared towards promotion and sale of non bp/w type bcs.
4. Many scubaboard posters provide an alternative to the retail scuba industry and promote bp/w instead.
5. Many scubaboard posters say that the bp/w is less bulky, more streamlined, has better trim, better weighting, better venting than non bp/w and tell this to new divers.
6. OP is irritated that many scubaboard posters provide anecdotal evidence of this nature to support their contentions.
7. OP doesn't like many scubaboard posters do this even though the retail scuba industry does this for their equipment.
8. This thread has established that non bp/w bcs do not work in every situation, such as tech diving, but are suitable for most applications.
9. This thread (presumably) has established that bp/w bcs work in every situation provided that you are not using a seven pound backplate when traveling light or a doubles wing when using a single AL80.
10. Jackets are not the sign of an inexperienced diver.
11. BP/W does not make a person a good diver.

What is wrong with posters on scubaboard promoting an alternative viewpoint from their own experience compared to the retail dive industry?

LOL.......

#11 - BP/W doesn't make me a better diver but it makes me a happier diver :blinking:

 

[Tortuga68]

Coming Up Next: Why you can't knock Spare Air & Split Fins

Film at 11

 

[Scott L]

I have also pointed out when opinionated people make absolute statements of fact that are unsupported ignorance.

BP/W's are more streamlined than Vest BC's

A bind man could determine that BP/W's are more streamline thereby creating less drag...

BP/W's vent easier than Vest BC's

Unless some fool retro-fits with a SS1 or Air2 gizmo...