Walk of shame

[Karibelle]

One additional point - your husband/buddy should have informed you of his omitted stop. It's one thing to miss a stop; it's another thing to be so cavalier about it! An omitted stop should result in some monitoring for symptoms while you're on the surface, so you can be prepared for the effects of the mistake, if there are any. By not advising you of the situation, he potentially put himself at even greater risk.

I'm not saying this is the case in your situation, but I think that husband/wife buddy teams need to consider some "dive buddy protocols." What I mean is, as married people diving together, we often bring our relationship baggage to our diving, and I think we'd be better off to set that baggage down when we pick up our gear, and look at our buddy as our dive partner rather than our life partner. We need to step away from our "defined roles" and be The Dive Buddy. There are things that I can say to my dive buddy that I might say a different way to my husband. Things like "Man, you have the biggest booger!" More importantly, I can critique my dive buddy in a way that I would not normally critique my husband, and when we're in that situation, it is important to know which I am dealing with.

I appreciate your thoughtful post. You've already learned a lot by being able to articulate your experience.

kari

 

[diverdan214]

I'm confused, with my computer if you miss a deco stop it locks up for 24 hours. I know because I had a similar experience to the OP describe and didn't really understand it was trying to tell me I needed to take longer to go up and make an extra stop, I just knew a bunch of stuff came up on the screen that I didn't understand.

So did your computer not go into error mode?

 

[DandyDon]

Jeeze! Fuzz, I see on your profile that you have your Aow - was looking for your computer brand.

I agree with others that gas management and communication is very important. I ask my buds for us to advise the other at 1500, 1000 and 500 - and include that with the dive plan, different way for different plans. Whichever one signals first, the other responds with what s/he has - or I ask? Point at SPG and twirl finer around the face seems to work. If 500 is before a prudent time to surface, we continue the Safety Stop sharing off the larger supply.

Getting to know your computer better - not just a basic understanding, running Simulation dives, planning your dives with your computer, safer diving - all good ideas.

She said he said...

"Yeah, my last dive ran into deco, but I didn't have enough air to stay down. I surfaced with about 6 minutes to go."

It probly did lock up, but he was "manly" and didn't mention it. It unlocked the next day, which was a travel day.

 

[diverdan214]

Ahh, musta misread, didn't realize it was a last dive of the trip thing, although I guess that's when you're most like to go over so makes sense.

 

[Fuzzmutton]

Ok, I'm back.

Man, oh man, have the replies piled up! Since it would be hard to answer all questions I'll say first thanks for all the good comments and thanks for being so tactful about my stupidity, then I'll try and answer a few questions.

1. I use a Suunto Cobra on the mid-range conservative setting because I normally dive cold water and I'm average physical fitness.

2. I was diving in warmer water, about mid-60's.

3. My son was with us on all but the last dive, but he buddied up with the divemaster because he is 12 and only had 4 dives previously. The divemaster took him up before us a couple times. He does not have a computer yet. We stayed within eyesite of him, usually close enough to get a fin in the face from him here and there . (Reminds me of a comedy routine I saw on a Vallarta Adventures snorkling tour where the guy was imitating someone being flippered half to death by the person in front of them..."Senoriiiiitaaa! Your fleeeeper!!", he kept saying.)

4. Yes, DandyDon, I am AOW. That doesn't make me an experienced diver, that just means I have another piece of plastic. We didn't cover any of this stuff in AOW, the stuff I messed up was OW basic material: dive planning, gas management and how to be a proper buddy. I'm not being smart with you, BTW, I always enjoy reading your posts.

5. My computer actually showed two violation symbols when I downloaded, and says specifically "violation". My husband may be at a different conservatism setting than I am, he has the added factor of being slightly overweight plus other health concerns (he was OK'd to dive).

6. Someone mentioned that we should have checked out the air situation while diving or agreed to go up at a certain PSI reading. We were continually checking the air on the last dive and when we hit 1000 we signaled LOA. Normally, at this point we would have just started a slow ascent and probably hubby would have been good at that point, but DM started leading the way back to anchor line and rather than ascend without him we followed.

7. Reading our manual, my husband's computer should have locked up. It was last dive, though, so no one noticed.

8. My problem with my computer is I rarely hear it beeping and sometimes a symbol will come up and then go away and I never know it's been there until I log my dive on the computer. A wrist mounted computer would be easier to keep track of, and one that vibrates would be excellant. What I really need though, is to not do things to make it beep to begin with!!

9. Thanks TSandM, I will look into that handout. I have never heard of exposure although I read everything on diving that I can get my hands on. I have heard of rock bottom although I just saw a discussion on it and don't really understand how to figure it. I wish there was a book out there that was somewhere BETWEEN all these books that are either tech manuals or books telling you how to pick out the best fins and mask

10. Hubby and I have already discussed my selfish, inconsiderate lack of hand signals at the safety stop. I can see my next dive (he sez, "no no it's a THUMBS up signal...you use the thumb, the THUMB!!) Now, guys, you know I'm kidding. I'm very contrite about that one and have promised to do better.


I think that's about all I can add for now. I have read all your posts and I appreciate the good advice, sorry if I missed anyone.


Fuzz

 

[Dive-aholic]

The Suunto Cobra is one of the most conservative computers out there. I was on a dive trip a couple of years back and someone on the boat also went into deco on the 3rd dive of the day. We were doing group dives. I was deeper than him a majority of the time during the dives. My computer never went into deco. So that part isn't a big deal, other than the fact that you weren't monitoring the computer closely enough to know you were close to deco. That's a problem. As for the RDP, it's a good tool, but it's not practical to plan most dive vacation dives where your profile isn't going to be square and isn't really even going to be know. You can use it to estimate your dive time, but keep in mind that as you get shallower, your NDL will lengthen. Look at your computer often. Don't rely on it to sound alarms. In fact, I have most of the alarms on my computer turned off because I can't hear them with a hood on either.

Gas management was a problem here. Back on the boat with 500psi is not a good dive plan. You need to plan your dives. Beginning your ascent at 1000psi on deeper dives is not a good plan. Following the DM just because that's when he was beginning his return was not a good plan. Either let the DM know when it's time for you to turn or follow the group at a shallower depth. Begin your ascent and do your safety stop as you make your way back, as long as visibility allows for this. And do get Bob's handout. I did and it's got lots of great information. In fact, I made my own little cheat sheet for SAC, RMV, and Rock Bottom calculations based on his handout.

Here's what I put together:


Surface Air Consumption (SAC)

starting psi – ending psi
----------------------------- = psi per minute
length of time in minutes

depth/33 + 1 = atmospheres absolute

psi per minute/atmospheres absolute = SAC

Example: 3000 psi – 1500 psi
------------------------ = 50 psi
30 minutes

75 ft/33 ft + 1 = 3.27 ATA

50 psi/3.27 ATA = 15.29 psi per minute

Round up to 16 psi per minute


Respiratory Minute Volume (RMV)

baseline = volume (in cf)/working pressure (in psi)

77.4cf/3000 psi = 0.026 cf per psi

RMV = SAC x baseline

16 psi per minute x 0.026 cf per psi =

0.416 cf per minute


SAC and RMV should be calculated for easy dives, moderate dives, and working dives.

Calculate easy rate on a dive where you glide along slow and easy, moderate rate while you are actively moving along, and working rate where you are kicking continuously and hard. Working rate should be calculated over a two minute period.


Rock Bottom – the absolute minimum amount of gas you need to get you and your buddy safely to the surface from your deepest planned depth while you are both breathing off of one cylinder.

Some rules and assumptions:

1. Working SAC rate should be used to calculate rock bottom pressures
2. You will need about a minute to begin your air share and sort out any problems
3. Ascent rate of 30 fpm
4. 3 minute safety stop at 15 fsw
5. 200 psi reserve at the surface
6. Dives below 80 fsw need an extra minute added for a safety stop at ½ the deepest depth
7. Never calculate a rock bottom of less than 500 psi

Step 1 – OOA share & problem assessment time at depth x depth (ata) x working RMV of 2 divers
Step 2 – Ascent from depth to 1st stop time to ascend x avg depth (ata) x RMV of 2 divers
Step 3 – Stop (1 minute deep stop if dive was > 80&#8217 stop time x stop depth (ata) x RMV
Step 4 – Ascent from 1st stop to safety stop (> 80&#8217 time to ascend x avg depth (ata) x RMV
Step 5 – Safety Stop time at stop x stop depth (ata) x RMV
Step 6 – Ascent from Safety stop time to ascend x avg depth (ata) x RMV
Step 7 – Total Gas Used sum of steps 1 through 6
Step 8 – Convert to psi cf gas needed/rated volume of tank/rated pressure of tank
Step 9 – Add 200 psi for Reserve add 200 to step 8 for Rock Bottom

Example:
Step 1 – 1 minute x 2.97 ata (65&#8217 x 3.12 (combined RMV) = 9.27 cf
Step 2 & 3 skipped because depth < 80&#8217;
Step 4 &#8211; 1.66 (1:40, ascent time 65&#8217; to 15&#8217 x 2.21 ata (avg depth 40&#8217 x 3.12 (combined RMV) = 11.44 cf
Step 5 &#8211; 3 minutes x 1.45 ata (15&#8217 x 3.12 = 13.57 cf
Step 6 - .5 (30 seconds, ascent time 15&#8217; to surface) x 1.22 ata (avg depth 7.5&#8217 x 3.12 = 1.91 cf
Step 7 &#8211; 9.27 + 11.44 + 13.57 + 1.91 = 36.19 cf
Step 8 &#8211; 36.19/77.4 x 1000 = 1403
Step 9 &#8211; 1403 + 200 = 1603 psi Total Rock bottom


Hope this helps. Also, if anyone wants a copy of the actual form I made, just PM me and I'll shoot a file over to you.

 

[TSandM]

When we do dive planning, we go through a quick checklist like this:

Goals -- What are we doing? Touring? Skills? Photography? Where are we going -- what's the proposed route? Specific sites?

Team -- Who's leading? Who's responsible for deploying a marker at the end of the dive, if we plan to do that? If we're doing skills, who's going first and what are they going to do?

Equipment -- Anything special we have with us or need to know about?

Exposure -- Depth and time. This will determine . . .

Deco -- What's the ascent strategy? Are we doing multi-level, or a direct ascent? Safety stop or stops -- where and for how long?

Gas -- Who's got what? What do we plan to use? What's rock bottom for this dive? What's the gas usage rule -- All available, halves, or thirds?

Environment -- Anything specific about the site we need to be mindful of? This can be entry challenges (surf, rocks, slippery ramps, type of boat entry, etc.) It can be current, or fishing line, or nets, or boats overhead -- Anything that we need to remember as we execute the dive.

It's a pretty good list.

 

[plot]

I'm more in danger of a flaming here than the original poster, but this is a valid point in a different scenario.

If you're aware of the conservative aspect of the computer, it could well stop you from a knee-jerk panic of "OMG I've got to do this because my computer says so!!!".

That's why I went on to say how important it was to strictly follow whatever guidelines you set (be it a computer or something else), regardless of how conservative/liberal they might be... it's not good advice to get into the mindset of "hey, my computers conservative so I'm good" whenever it's beeping at you, but at the same time I still doubt the husband was ever in any real danger.

 

[DandyDon]

Yes, DandyDon, I am AOW. That doesn't make me an experienced diver, that just means I have another piece of plastic. We didn't cover any of this stuff in AOW, the stuff I messed up was OW basic material: dive planning, gas management and how to be a proper buddy. I'm not being smart with you, BTW, I always enjoy reading your posts.

Well, yes - I didn't learn anything in my Aow or my Rescue by the time I took them. You did your Aow earlier. Anyway, I've already stated my simple suggestions about air communictin - and my intense feelings of knowing your computer well.

Something I did my first 100 dives that helped - carried my console in my left hand at all times, so I'd look at it more. No camera. Hold left hand in right hand. Dive computers are not going to get louder (TG!) nor vibrate like your pocket phone - it's up to the diver to observe closely.

 

[ianr33]

Something I did my first 100 dives that helped - carried my console in my left hand at all times, so I'd look at it more.

Why not just put it on your wrist and be done with it