VIP on AL cylinders = stupid $$$ game

[drew52]

Personally I think you guys should stop being so damn cheap. As some others have said its ok for you guys who dive as a hobby to make a profit, but damn those greedy LDS's for trying to earn a living. I guess its capatalism for everyone else and those LDS people well they should do everything for the love of the sport. Give us a break, even at $25 its not bad. If you do a proper VIP with part replacements and valve service how long do you think it takes? Then you add the airfill. Although again if you are an LDS you can't charge for time because then its a money making scam.

If you own your own tank and dive say 2 dives a week thats 104 dives a year. Lets see thats about 25cents a dive for the VIP less if you take out the cost of the airfill. Tell me its not cheap to whine about that kind of cost And besides its pretty important to get them done each year for all the reasons mentioned already and probably a few more.

 

[Hoyden]

I am pretty sure that no dive shop cares about the visual on your tank until you ask them to fill it. Fill your tank all you want from your compressor or bank. Once you ask someone else to fill your tank from their compressor/bank, you need to play by their rules. Vips are not a real money maker for dive shops - they are a way to be sure that the tanks being filled are safe to fill.

 

[Gil57usa]

what about your SCBA's ? do they visual those every year?





Heh.. I thought Jonathon was the "tank fill monkey" ?

Yes, the SCBA's all get vised as well. All 60 bottles. It takes a good chunk out of the budget, but what is safety worth?

 

[mike_s]

Yes, the SCBA's all get vised as well. All 60 bottles. It takes a good chunk out of the budget, but what is safety worth?

60 SCBA's + 13 AL80's + ponys.... = 73+ tanks. At $10 each that's $730 or more a year with pony's. (but we can assume you get a discount for volume and maybe a little cheaper. At $5/vis that's still almost $400.

Send someone from your department to the PSI Cylinder course. It's only a couple hundred bucks. That would be cheaper than paying to visual them all at a LDS. It'll pay for itself the first year.

 

[Scared Silly]

heck, when I moved to FL, two out of the three tanks I had were deemed "too dangerous to fill" and I was told that no one would fill them. not because they had any signs of damage, or failed inspection, but because they were the older tanks. the shop owner took the valve off, and damaged the neck so it couldn't be filled.

If any shop did this to one of my cylinders the conversation would be very short - You owe me two new tanks or it is off to court we go. It is one thing to condem a tank but it is wholely another to destroy it for use.

I just did my PSI refresher while at DEMA. I only have 4 four cylinders so it will be a fair amount of time before I recoupe the $$ I spent on the course travel, etc. But to me it is worth it. (I also do a few friend's cylinders as well) Also I often travel with cylinders so I have to take the valve off and anytime a completely empty cylinder shows up for filling it should be reinspected as such I can do it myself rather than have the resprt do it. Saves some hassle.

BTW I just did all of my cylinders - one had got a wet fill as I could see many small spots of corrosion.

 

[Nemrod]

This VIP stuff is not magic. If your concerned about the condition of the tank or there being contamination take the valve off and look in there. You can make an excellent inspection light from those string lights at Lowes or visit your local SnapOn truck. Just because we are not getting "official" VIPs does not mean the tanks are not being inspected. Any red blooded handiman ought to be able to do an inpsection, even build a tumbler if needed. I think if I can inspect turbine engine components I can determine the safety of my scuba tanks. Besides, every aluminum tank I own which is several is shiny and clean on the inside. It is those d--n steel tanks that always need a tumble, I have eight and unlike the aluminums I have, they are a PITA. N

 

[do it easy]

If any shop did this to one of my cylinders the conversation would be very short - You owe me two new tanks or it is off to court we go. It is one thing to condem a tank but it is wholely another to destroy it for use.

I think the "best practice" is to have the customer sign an agreement that gives the LDS the authority to condemn the tank and render it unuseable if they see fit.

 

[redacted]

I think the "best practice" is to have the customer sign an agreement that gives the LDS the authority to condemn the tank and render it unuseable if they see fit.

That is when I go find another LDS.

 

[Dive-aholic]

I am pretty sure that no dive shop cares about the visual on your tank until you ask them to fill it. Fill your tank all you want from your compressor or bank. Once you ask someone else to fill your tank from their compressor/bank, you need to play by their rules. Vips are not a real money maker for dive shops - they are a way to be sure that the tanks being filled are safe to fill.

Not all shops. I saw the shop I used to use do a couple of VIPs. Old stickers were left on. The outside wasn't examined. The inside was just visualized for moisture or discoloration. Threads weren't even checked! I don't think they know why they're doing a VIP other than it's an industry standard. I don't think they even know about the 6351 alloy! That's when I started doing my own. And then I discovered they were using a ton of Cristolube on the threads and o-ring!

Thankfully, not all shops are quite that ignorant.

 

[anakin]

I am pretty sure that no dive shop cares about the visual on your tank until you ask them to fill it. Fill your tank all you want from your compressor or bank. Once you ask someone else to fill your tank from their compressor/bank, you need to play by their rules. Vips are not a real money maker for dive shops - they are a way to be sure that the tanks being filled are safe to fill.

BAM. Hoyden sums it all up right there. VIPs are there to shut down on accidents, and liability issues. You can go back and forth on wether or not YOU think a VIP is worth it on your tanks, you can also do it yourself and fill your own tanks yourself. BUT if someone comes to me to fill a tank off my compressor, they better have a current VIP, and if they dont theres no way im filling it without one. I just dont think its safe, and when a tank fails on you im sure youll think the same way!