cyklon_300
Contributor
meisburger:
Maybe somebody will start a thread on it...
Using A Long Hose Isn't Just For Tech Divers
- Thread starter OE2X
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Maybe somebody will start a thread on it...
keelhaul123
Contributor
Personally as a rec diver I see little or no reason for using the long hose. Yes, if I was a cave diver where I might need to share air while passing through a constriction I can see its benefit. However, in an openwater situation it seems pointless toi have 7' of hose wrapped around me. As most OW divers are taught, in an OOA situation, assuming a non-paniced dive buddy, you will head to the surface, sharing your octo, face to face. How much hose do you need? If the OOA diver is THAT paniced that sharing air will endanger you as well as him, then it really doesn't matter how long that hose is!OE2X:
H2Andy
Contributor
keelhaul123:
you'd be surprised. i've only done a few ascents sharing air with an OOA diver
(simulated) and having those extra two feet of distance between you really
make a difference.
it's just a lot easier to have that extra room between you and your buddy as
you are slowly ascending together.
it's certainly not pointless. it does make things a lot easier.
MASS-Diver
Contributor
keelhaul123:
Have you practice a lot of OOAs - most OW can't share air well at all. Face to face as in vertical leads to rapid runaway ascents and big problems. You need to be able to share air and both make a slow, controlled, ascent to the surface. If you have only practice this in a pool when you took OW - that's a problem - do some air sharing drills in 20, 30, or 40' of water - you will see right away the advantage of the long hose. Right off the bat - it's very easy to deploy a 7'er at arm lenght as you swim at the OOA diver.
Once the ponds unfreeze, I'd be glad to do a few dives with you if you want to see what the "long hose" scene is all about. I promise I'm not 1/2 the jerk I come off as online.
And, once final note, donating an octo is not cool - the OOA diver needs gas NOW - it has to work - you always give them the reg you are breathing.
This was covered about 600 posts ago. You'd be surprised how much more normal the ascent is on a long hose. Plus, since there is lots of room and no tugging on the hose interfering with the air sharing, I think it helps calm the OOA diver a bit.keelhaul123:
It's ok to have an opinion on a long hose, but unless you have actually tried it yourself, you'd be far better off keeping an open mind. Particularly since you are in that danger zone of 100 to 200 dives where you think you are pretty skilled but have not yet learned enough to realize how much stuff you still don't know. The same phenomenon occurs with pilots with about 100 hours who are statistically at about their peak risk for crashing and burning.
keelhaul123:
Scenario: Open water dive. You just went down to 100' on air for 17 minutes of bottom time. You have just spent an additional 2 minutes coming up to 70'. You are still within NDL, but just barely. All of the sudden your buddy signals OOA - caused by an O-ring failure. You donate a reg and signal to go to the surface. You still have 2000 psi in an AL80
A. Do you go directly to the surface at 30' per minute?
B. Do you go to the surface and make your saftey stop or stops?
If you chose A. you would run the unnecessary risk of both divers getting bent.
If you chose B. you would still have plenty of gas to make a 3 minute stop at 15' or conservatively make 1 minute stops at 40', 30' 20' and 10'.
Now if you are making your stops where would you like your buddy?
If you chose facing you in horizontal trim with maneuvering room or to your side then having a long hose would be the prefered gear. I don't want my buddy sandwiched next to me for my stops.
If you chose going to the surface and blowing off your stops - well frankly where your buddy is ie... in front, behind or beside you is of little issue. You are both going to take a hit. Some would say better bent than dead, but under this scenario it's not necessary to get bent.
Now explain to me why using a long hose isn't beneficial.
meisburger
Guest
OE2X:
In the very unlikely event this occured, you would not get bent because you are still withing your NDLs. But, if in the very unlikely event I am ever involved in an OOA situation, I reckon I can stand the discomfort of a safety stop, or even a deco stop, with my buddy quite close. Depending on the buddy, it might even be preferable!
True, you are just barely within your NDL, but you still run the risk of both divers taking an undeserved hit.meisburger:
If it were my wife as my buddy, then sure it wouldn't be so bad. Anyone else - I'd prefer a long hose.
JeffG
Contributor
The NDL is not a bend/no bend line...unfortunately its closer to a statistical probability...which is based on certain asumptions...ascent rate...etc etc...which may be violated in the above scenario.meisburger:
dbulmer
Contributor
KeelHaul123,
"However, in an openwater situation it seems pointless toi have 7' of hose wrapped around me."
If your concern is that it might get tangled then yes it could happen which is why advocates of the long hose suggest you learn how to stow and deploy it from someone more experienced. Once you know how to do it, you don't notice it underwater.
The other thing you have to remember is to clip off your primary (long hose) reg when you are not using it. If you don't do this when DIR blokes are around it's a beer fine over here and maybe a Kool-Aid fine over there
Actually one point I'd like to make to anyone out there who does not use a long hose and is inexperienced (I'm inexperienced too).
If you run low on air/ out of air and someone donates their long hose, please take it.
I was in a low on air situation in Cancun recently and had my long hose refused by an inexperienced diver who preferred to use the DM's octo which meant she ended up getting stressed even more needlessly while she waited for the DM to get to her.
The only thing I think that you do have to remember is that when you are on the surface you remove the backup first (ie the octo round your neck assuming that's how you would be rigged) when dekitting.
bTW
"However, in an openwater situation it seems pointless toi have 7' of hose wrapped around me."
If your concern is that it might get tangled then yes it could happen which is why advocates of the long hose suggest you learn how to stow and deploy it from someone more experienced. Once you know how to do it, you don't notice it underwater.
The other thing you have to remember is to clip off your primary (long hose) reg when you are not using it. If you don't do this when DIR blokes are around it's a beer fine over here and maybe a Kool-Aid fine over there
Actually one point I'd like to make to anyone out there who does not use a long hose and is inexperienced (I'm inexperienced too).
If you run low on air/ out of air and someone donates their long hose, please take it.
I was in a low on air situation in Cancun recently and had my long hose refused by an inexperienced diver who preferred to use the DM's octo which meant she ended up getting stressed even more needlessly while she waited for the DM to get to her.
The only thing I think that you do have to remember is that when you are on the surface you remove the backup first (ie the octo round your neck assuming that's how you would be rigged) when dekitting.
bTW
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