Two divers die at Wazee Lake, WI

[Cave Diver]

These teams can be 2 or 3 or more (I believe).

Teams are typically either 2 or 3. Any more than that and the teams get split into teams of two or three.

4 = 2 teams of 2
5 = 3 person team and 2 person team
6 = 2 teams of 3 or 3 teams of 2.
etc.

 

[Kingpatzer]

That's an unknown, isn't it?
The only safe answer is "none" - after all, aren't we setting our deco at the shortest possible safe limit?

I'm very new to deco diving, so I don't want to get out of my depth here (sorry, bad pun) but I compute my deco stops using air tables and actually use 80% for my shallow stops. So I would GUESS I have the ability to blow off at least some of my schedule.

But I also realize many more people plan their dive based on their gas, and don't have that extra safety margin.

I believe that Milt,at least, had the same instructor I did, and if so may have been following the same rules. But that is pure speculation, obviously he could have been planning his dives using his exact mixes.

 

[razn1]

If they were a team of three then why did they split up?

 

[razn1]

Would be very interested to see what there tanks had left for air and also there computer profiles for this dive.

 

[Cave Diver]

The only safe answer is "none" - after all, aren't we setting our deco at the shortest possible safe limit?

No. At least I'm not.

Most deco programs have conservative factors built in and no one that I personally knows is running them using the minimal safety factors. Since there are so many individual variables that can contribute to DCS like rest, hydration, etc. I think anyone who is using the shortest possible safe limit is playing Russian Roulette with it.

"Safe" varies from day to day and I think anyone planning their dives at the shortest limit is begging to get bit by it.

Ideally, passing an injured diver off to surface support would be the way to go, but realistically how many people are using surface support for a 200' dive?

I think most divers are planning dives to take into account ways of extending their deco times to cover lost deco gas, extra bottom time, etc. but very few have given much thought to how much deco they can comfortably cut out of the schedule.

 

[Cave Diver]

If they were a team of three then why did they split up?

Because they weren't diving as a team.

If the plan was to do 200' and then one person decided during the dive to stay at 140', then they effectively had a team of two and a solo diver.

I'm very new to deco diving, so I don't want to get out of my depth here (sorry, bad pun) but I compute my deco stops using air tables and actually use 80% for my shallow stops. So I would GUESS I have the ability to blow off at least some of my schedule.

Just out of curiosity, why?

 

[DandyDon]

update Divers who died in Lake Wazee were 'like brothers' - TwinCities.com

Officials are probing whether two divers who died after surfacing too quickly from Wisconsin's deepest inland lake descended deeper than their training and certifications allowed. However, whatever prompted their rush to the surface remains a mystery.

Services are today for James M. Jordan, 57, of Eagan, who was remembered Monday as a father, biker, soccer referee and experienced diver. He and fellow diver Milton R. Floyd were regulars at Lake Wazee in Black River Falls, Wis., an artificial lake made from a flooded iron mine descending 355 feet into the earth.

"They dove all the time together, and I respect their friendship," said Keith Cormican, the owner of Wazee Sports Center, a dive shop near the lake. "They were good guys. To see them being that active at their age, they were very active divers."

Jordan is survived by his wife, adult daughter and 11 siblings. A memorial will be held at 1 p.m. at St. John Neumann Catholic Church, 4030 Pilot Knob Road, Eagan.

Floyd's widow, CJ Floyd, told Minnesota Public Radio News she will scatter her husband's ashes on the Great Lakes. The men were diving between 140 and 200 feet, but she said a third diver, Milo Squires, 53, of Chaska, wasn't as deep and surfaced first because he was running low on air.

Jordan worked at the Data-card Group, a Minnetonka company specializing in creating identification cards. Squires also works there.

The Jackson County sheriff's office said the cause of Jordan's death is undetermined. An autopsy is pending. Jordan was in cardiac arrest when emergency crews arrived to find other divers already performing CPR.

The Hennepin County medical examiner said Floyd, 60, of Minneapolis, died from "probable medical complications of rapid ascent."

Floyd and Squires had been taken to a hyperbaric chamber at the Hennepin County Medical Center, a pressurized room used to treat divers suffering from "the bends" — the potentially fatal expansion of nitrogen in the bloodstream.

Crews arrived at the scene at 12:15 p.m. Saturday and rushed the divers to Black River Memorial Hospital, where Jordan was pronounced dead.

The other men were flown to the medical center in Minneapolis. Floyd was declared dead at about 7:40 p.m. Squires was treated and released.

Cormican, who was at the lake after the men surfaced, said he believes Squires had problems with his gear and ascended rapidly with help from others in the area.

Jordan and Floyd were deeper and, for an unknown reason, also ascended rapidly 10 minutes later, he said. The sudden ascents may have been unrelated. "When Milo came up, I don't know the other two would have known that," Cormican said. He said Jordan and Floyd were "like brothers." Their electronic depth registers showed they descended deeper than certifications allowed.

He said Jordan was treated about a year ago after surfacing too quickly then, as well.

"These guys, Milt and Jim, were very avid divers. But something happened out there, and I don't think we're ever going to know."

 

[TSandM]

Not that you can't assist others, but your air is really only meant for yourself and one other person in an out of air circumstance. What if two of the three ran out of air in an extreme case, then you your air has to be split three ways? That just seems like poor planning.

A friend of mine calls this "Little House on the Prairie" scenarios. You can ALWAYS come up with a set of failures that makes something not work . . . but in real life, catastrophic failures are rare (if you are diligent) and the odds of having two of them on the same dive are astronomically low. On the other hand, if you do have someone with a gas issue in a team of three, you have TWO divers' worth of reserves to get him out on -- all of a sudden, that not-so-conservative third becomes two-thirds, and much more comforting.

 

[razn1]

There's a little more info on the web now. The survivor said he discovered an air leak and surfaced blowing his safety stop. If that was the case the dive should have been called right there and his buddies should have helped him surface safely. Also read the other two made it through most of the dive and at some point during a stop something went wrong and that's when they surfaced. Still not all the specifics, but its getting a little less murky

 

[Cave Diver]

There's a little more info on the web now. The survivor said he discovered an air leak and surfaced blowing his safety stop. If that was the case the dive should have been called right there and his buddies should have helped him surface safely. Also read the other two made it through most of the dive and at some point during a stop something went wrong and that's when they surfaced. Still not all the specifics, but its getting a little less murky

Do you have links to this information?