TSA, the Fun Never Ends..

[HowardE]

I just was remarking that every time I fly it's some new procedure. Shoes? no shoes. Flip flops can stay on, sometimes they can't....I would like to see a little less attitude as they put us through the paces, that's all. It is not always the same, but the guy was giving me a big lecture, telling me just that.

Maybe the inconsistent procedures are to keep people from getting too used to one certain thing. It keeps everyone on their toes. Maybe that's part of the grand design? (although that seems highly unlikely)

Like someone here said. Background screens are only so good for so long. Just because someone has a clean record and an untarnished past doesn't mean that they won't be carrying explosives on board a plan, now does it?

Israel sure has been running safe air travel for years and years. They also have heavily armed guards walking around the airports, and it is also within their countries rights to profile people, where in the US, it's technically forbidden, but I'm sure they do profile somewhat. The TSA isn't the best system going, but it's what we have now, and I seriously doubt that someone would try to make the case that the old system in the U.S. was better. Maybe it's somewhat annoying to the less frequent traveler who doesn't follow up on the current regulations for travel. Maybe it's more of a pain to put your gel in a quart sized ziploc bag. It all seems somewhat ludicrous, but it's just what we have to deal with. I always just take off my shoes, belt, cell phone, watch, and silver bracelet. I don't find the removal of my shoes to be a humiliation, I do think it's a little ridiculous, but rather than make a stink, I just want to pass through in a timely fashion, and get on with my life.

 

[Bill51]

There’s a lot more to be said good about inconsistencies in security than most people realize. I also think there are many improvements that could be made using some form of profiling that would be less intrusive than the no-fly lists that have to be made ultra-strict to protect someone from being accused of profiling. It would only take a few highly skilled (and more highly paid) government employees to monitor passengers and have a way to flag someone for more scrutiny. Unfortunately that person would be constantly second guessed the way our laws are now and could easily be intimidated into being too lenient.

 

[AXL72]

I don't find the removal of my shoes to be a humiliation, I do think it's a little ridiculous, but rather than make a stink, I just want to pass through in a timely fashion, and get on with my life.

Maybe you ultimately get to make your stink with the removal of your shoes

 

[garyfotodiver]

With all due respect, as Richard Jackson put it in a quote often attributed to Benjamin Franklin, "Those who would give up Essential Liberty to purchase a little Temporary Safety, deserve neither Liberty nor Safety."

I travel quite a bit. A few years back, I was wearing my kippah when I was flying from Sacramento, CA back to southern California. It was a big mistake. The middle eastern TSA guards virtually strip searched me. Suffice it to say that I do not wear any of my kippah when traveling.

For personal observation, the application of the "rules" are both arbitrary and capricious, subject only to the whims and will of low paid "security" employees with little or no training and, judging from recent uncovered errors, very little security vetting, themselves.

I have a feeling that the founding fathers of our nation are rolling over in their graves at the current injustices been perpetrated in the name of "security" and "freedom".

As a naturalized American Citizen, I mean no disrespect to the service men and women who have bravely fought and paid for the freedoms and privileges I enjoy as an American.

I wear my kippah when I travel. I do not take it off and have never been asked to do so.

My wife and my two married daughters do not uncover their hair in public. They will do so if taken to a private area with only females in attendance. When asked by a TSAer to take off the hat, they politely refuse unless their privacy is assured.

The USA is a country of laws where the majority rules and the minority has rights. Eventually, no matter how long it might take, this dictum prevails.

 

[Cacia]

How is a kippah different from a yamaka?

Are you Hassidic? Who wears those? Do orthodox women cover their hair? I know they do in temple...

TSA probably does not know the difference.

I am not saying security should be consisitent, my point was that the guy lectured me about how "it has been like this for six months and I should know that we would have to leave the airport and re-enter" NOT true. My very next flight they were tossing items right in security. I don't think TSA employees fly much, frankly. They only know their little airport.

 

[HowardE]

How is a kippah different from a yamaka?

They're not different.

 

[Cacia]

well, Jews don't highjack planes, everybody knows that.

Guess we are supposed to pretend they might?...just to be fair?

 

[Bill51]

well, Jews don't highjack planes, everybody knows that.

Guess we are supposed to pretend they might?...just to be fair?

Which raises a very interesting sidenote. An acquaintance in the Air Marshall service made a comment about the unintended benefit we would gain by greater use of profiling. If we were to start profiling the same way a few other countries do it would force the terrorist organizations to start recruiting more people that didn’t fit the standard profile, and that would make it easier for our intel people to infiltrate the terrorist organizations and stop some actions before they got to the final implementation stages.

 

[Missdirected]

Well, Lamont, you will probably get your wish.

I would like to applaud the record of whoever has kept us safe here at home since 9-11. We will just never know all the details, but I am impressed that nothing major has happened. Newt says we will lose an American city this decade.

I am not so quick to forget the
"other" 3000 lives we lost, BTW.

An optional background check is at least as Democratic as your short line for "preffered" flyers, Howarde.

You want to be favored for having spent more money....I want to be favored for not being a felon and so on. What's the difference?

No, TSA is not being effective from what I see. Which would be fine, if it were not so expensive. I am telling you, Indonesia has it down from outward appearances. I hear the Israelis are pretty effective also.

Well stated Catherine.

Additionally, just because one does not believe TSA to be effective does not in fact mean that one is saying the old way was better.

This is just my opinion, but I would not mind armed guards, just like they have in Israel, guarding my safety at the airport. That said, I would want real trained professionals, not the majority of people who are currently employed by TSA and thus having to follow TSA guidelines to point of ridiculousness.

Take the paycheck of several TSA employees, who in my opinion and many others, are not qualified to protect my safety, and give it to one armed person who is. Money much better spent.

As for the airlines not securing us before... well now they know better, just as many civilians do now, I still believe if it were left to the airlines and not our government we would be much better off and at a better price tag. Privatization, will lead to quality security.

*Lamont, do you need more popcorn? Here you go, just in case *

 

[Missdirected]

Going back to the mentality of too many employed by the TSA - actually this also speaks to the guidelines of what the employees are told to do;

I was going through security, think I was coming from NY last year, wearing a see-through white camisole. I was wearing it more as support, if you will. Anyway, over that I had a pink button down shirt. I had the shirt unbuttoned down to the top of the white cami, so you could just see the top of it. You were required to remove any extra layers of clothing (meant for jackets and things). Anyway, I was asked to remove my outer shirt. I let the guy know that my undershirt wasn't actually a shirt that it was more of a bra. As usual the guy wouldn't let me finishing speaking just kept barking. I tried to tell him he would basically be having me walk through half naked. Still not listening. So rather than be late for my flight, and possibly miss it, by asking for a supervisor, I removed the shirt... I do believe he turned a bit red when I went through :winky:

It was quite uncomfortable and at first horribly embarrassing but I figured I have been through a hell of a lot worse, and heck I have teenagers, so that was nothing :winky:

Note: Before anyone says it. I am also one of those that tries to do ask TSA asks. As soon as the shoe thing was started, before everyone was doing it, I would be sure to wear shoes that slipped on and off easily and took them off wether asked to or not. So yes, I do know the rules and try to adhere to them to the best of my ability.