TSA got you down?

[tarponchik]

1. Israeli agent failing to detect test runs (they get tested on a regular basis) loses his/her job on the spot.

2. TSA agents don't get fired for that.

This only means that the Israelis are prone to error too.

3. People bring all sorts of things past TSA that we know of (Adam Savage story for example).

I myself managed to get knives past TSA accidently twice (forgotten in my backpack pockets), and they caught me once with a similarly forgotten knife. Sure, these guys are dummies, no doubt about that. But this is exactly what scares me when folks like you suggest switching to the Israeli model. After all, when it came to profiling and judgement, they managed to blacklist Nelson Mandela and the late senator Ted Kennedy. I'd rather have stupid people operate metal detectors at the gates than use their brains, cause instead of being more efffective and/or efficient they will do more damage.

4. No such known incident for #3 when it comes to Israeli security.

But maybe nobody really tied--at least, no such cases are known.

 

[Mike Boswell]

I still fail to see how it is the federal goverments job to provide security for private airlines. That to me is the first issue, all the other stuff is secondary.

Did you ever get a check from the government, explaining that they collected too much money that year, didn't need it all, and so they were returning the un-used portion to you?

NO? Me neither. Not in my long, long lifetime. Or in my father's or grandfather's lifetime either.

Well, the reason for that is, government ALWAYS spends ALL the money they get, and then some, and if they don't have a use for it, they CREATE one.

 

[redacted]

I still fail to see how it is the federal goverments job to provide security for private airlines. That to me is the first issue, all the other stuff is secondary.

"We the people of the United States, in order to form a more perfect union, establish justice, insure domestic tranquility, provide for the common defense, promote the general welfare, and secure the blessings of liberty to ourselves and our posterity, do ordain and establish this Constitution for the United States of America."

It's not the airplanes they are securing. It is "WE THE PEOPLE".

 

[inventor]

Did you ever get a check from the government, explaining that they collected too much money that year, didn't need it all, and so they were returning the un-used portion to you?

Yes, a few years ago Bush sent out checks. Got my $300.

 

[iztok]

But maybe nobody really tied--at least, no such cases are known.

No-one really tried to bypass Israeli security? Seriously? Seriously?!? Do you really need geography lesson where Israel is?

 

[MXGratefulDiver]

Yes, a few years ago Bush sent out checks. Got my $300.

... but that wasn't because they failed to spend all the money they collected. It was just the government running us deeper in debt ...

... Bob (Grateful Diver)

 

[iztok]

It's not the airplanes they are securing. It is "WE THE PEOPLE".

When you want to fly you have no choice.

Porn scanner or sexual assault is not a choice. One should at least have to have a choice to walk away as a third option.

When robber points a gun and asks you for your wallet or your life and you give him your wallet, you really didn't have a choice, did you?

 

[oldnotdead]

I still fail to see how it is the federal goverments job to provide security for private airlines. That to me is the first issue, all the other stuff is secondary.

Sorry, I had to bite.

Ask the families of the victims on and since 9/11/01 about who's job it is. Private airlines (businesses) are incapable of protecting anything but their own interests without government oversight. I know because we have seen it happen over and over again. How many airliners would have to be destroyed, with the human cost as an aside to the capital costs, before airline sponsored screening would begin.
Remember, safety begins at home, protection begins abroad.
OND

 

[shoredivr]

I haven't done a whole lot of international travel but if you just have a connecting flight going through the US don't you stay in a secure area that doesn't require you to be re-screened? If you leave that area aren't you required to clear customs? I am just asking because I don't know.

It is not nearly as intelligent as that. I was on a flight from Sydney Australia that went to Vancouver Canada via Honolulu. Only a few of us were getting off in Honolulu, and we of course expected to go through US customs and immigration. The vast majority were continuing to Vancouver and getting back onto the same plane. Every one of the passengers had to go through customs and immigration, including fingerprinting, despite the fact they were just in transit. The Australians on the flight were really not impressed, they said they felt they were treated like common criminals regarding the fingerprinting, and would never consider going to the States in the future. Nobody had been informed before the flight that this would happen. They thought, like you, that they would just stay in a secure area.

If your plane even goes through American airspace without landing in the States (which some domestic Canadian flights do, say flying from southwestern Ontario to the Prairies, you would fly over Michigan, etc) the American government demands the personal information of passengers, which is at the present contrary to Canadian law.

I agree the TSA is illmannered and the screening process is a joke. How does it differ in Canada? The places I have been (though limited) have included a pat down prior to boarding the plane bound for the US.

If you fly from Toronto to the States, you will go through US customs and immigration right there in Canada. Through a legal agreement between the two countries, this area of the Pearson International Airport is considered to be American soil. So you go through American security etc right there in Canada. It was originally intended to speed things up flying into the States, you'd be pre-cleared. Well, since Sept 11, 2001, most US airports put you through customs and immigration if you are from a foreign destination as a matter of course, so it means you are going through US customs and immigration twice if you fly through Pearson. Which is why I avoid this airport when flying to the States. Once through the process in a single flight is quite enough.

 

[tyesai]

"We the people of the United States, in order to form a more perfect union, establish justice, insure domestic tranquility, provide for the common defense, promote the general welfare, and secure the blessings of liberty to ourselves and our posterity, do ordain and establish this Constitution for the United States of America."

It's not the airplanes they are securing. It is "WE THE PEOPLE".

Nice, that is the preamble, it is an introduction, it does not go on to say the Federal Goverment shall provide security for private companies. But we've become so used to the politicians doing what ever they want and running the people over that we don't even think about it, instead we just say they are securing our "safety" with no thought to what their role is or what they should be doing or more importantly not doing.