The Grand Traverse in Peacock Springs.

[netmage]

I'm not familiar with the NAUI standards. I always equated Cave 1 to NACD Intro. Under Intro, it would be outside of standards because it involves complex navigation.

NAUI Cave Diver I - QUALIFICATIONS OF GRADUATES
Upon successful completion of this course, graduates are considered competent to plan and execute limited penetration, simple navigation cave dives that are within the no decompression limits & without direct supervision, provided the diving activities and the areas dived approximate those of training.

Naui Cave 1 does require students to carry a "bailout bottle" I think, but I think it can be dropped on the line whenever. I'm not sure about this, if someone else cares to comment I'm all ears. In other words, what I'm saying is while NAUI Cave 1 might not allow stage bottles, it does apparently have divers practice the only difficult part that isn't learned in open water, which is clipping and unclipping. Everything else about a stage bottle is something a diver should have a grasp of after open water, and certainly after completing a technical diving course such as cave 1.

NAUI Cave Diver I - COURSE POLICIES
....
• One staged cylinder will be carried into the overhead environment and available for the team.
...

This is a safety bottle used during class dives, and is typically left with the primary reel. This is NOT an ongoing dive requirement.

Here we have a case of an agency not making training standards very clear. Is it fair to criticize someone for not knowing what defined a traverse when naui makes it basically impossible to find their definition of it?

Standards are crystal clear.... Page 46.... Simple navigation - This level of training is limited to two navigational decisions during a dive, and returning to the same entrance location during the exit.

Therefore.....This dive is only possible under a Cave 1 certification if you are able to swim Peacock - OG in back mounted (or equivilent sidemount/nonstaged configuration) 3rds then swim back.

The gap at Olsen or Challenge sinks are NOT navigational decisions - you are simply reconnecting two ends of line.

NAUI's cave 1 program is more like Apprentice in dive standards, however if you cross over to another agency, you'd likely have to take apprentice, then full...

-Tim - yes, I took NAUI cave 1.

 

[Superlyte27]

I love how we constantly make issues of non-issues on this forum. I guess most of us got nothing better to do except argue stuff that doesn't need to be argued. Pete, any time you're ready, let me know we'll go do this dive. We'll never reach thirds at any point in the dive.

 

[netmage]

I love how we constantly make issues of non-issues on this forum. I guess most of us got nothing better to do except argue stuff that doesn't need to be argued. Pete, any time you're ready, let me know we'll go do this dive. We'll never reach thirds at any point in the dive.

The only other possible option (I can think of) to do this dive in backmount 3rds is as a one way trip, recalculating in each sink... which clearly violates the explicit definition of simple navigation as same entrance\exit in the standards.

Your dancing around components in the standards and walking a fine line between the spirit and the letter... It's **** like that, that gets people killed and sites closed.

 

[Superlyte27]

If I get Netdoc killed on one of the easiest cave dives in Florida, I promise to quit posting here. Fair enough?

*edit
If we do this as three separate dives, with a surface interval of greater than 10 minutes. Calculating for turn around at each surface interval, never reaching thirds, but IF we did were able to simply turn around, then what's the issue? Seriously, anyone who's done this dive knows this dive is a no brainer.

 

[netmage]

If I get Netdoc killed on one of the easiest cave dives in Florida, I promise to quit posting here. Fair enough?

The 'rules' don't apply to you and yours... got it...

 

[Superlyte27]

Don't agree with you on the rule you think I'm breaking.

 

[PfcAJ]

If I get Netdoc killed on one of the easiest cave dives in Florida, I promise to quit posting here. Fair enough?

*edit
If we do this as three separate dives, with a surface interval of greater than 10 minutes. Calculating for turn around at each surface interval, never reaching thirds, but IF we did were able to simply turn around, then what's the issue? Seriously, anyone who's done this dive knows this dive is a no brainer.

Didn't a lady JUST die on one of the "easiest" cave dives in Florida? IJS...

 

[Superlyte27]

Yah, a friend of mine, and as it turned out, it was a medical condition. Diabetes and bad diet plan in the previous weeks.

 

[Superlyte27]

The point is... does anyone see an issue with making a dive from say Olsen to P1, not reaching thirds?

This is no different. It's just three small dives that never reach thirds. Always on mainline, no complex navigation, no stage bottles. If you reach thirds, you turn around. This isn't a "hunt for the exit", this is stay on the mainline until you have to turn and "oops, there's the surface".

 

[PfcAJ]

Yah, a friend of mine, and as it turned out, it was a medical condition. Diabetes and bad diet plan in the previous weeks.

I'm sorry for your loss, but that is interesting, I had not heard that. A bit conflicting, actually, with what I had read on the boards previously. I'm curious as to how the diabetes/ diet plan turned into a fatal navigation error post diving past training and multiple blind jumps. I suppose that's for another thread.

I see what you're driving at, and its a reasonable way to execute the dive. What I don't support is the attempt to shoehorn dives to fit some "standard". Why not just take full cave and be done with it?