The Buddy system and separation problems

[Paulb2]

Thanks for the feedback it was very interesting.

Which agencies teach solo diving?

From the previous notes it could be understood that not all divers believe the Buddy System is an effective way of dealing with underwater diving problems (I wonder what percentage), and solo divers can be equally well prepared? I would be interested to know how solo divers might tackle the following problems without the aid of a buddy: -

·When under the influence of nitrogen Narcosis
·Running out of air
·Cramp and/or the need to be towed
·A heart attack
(Other suggestions)

What are the main motives for divers to dive solo? Are these motives common amongst most divers (beginners to experienced) to a greater or lesser extent?
Is solo diving to get away from people, to feel less restricted? Maybe the current training system is often ineffective because it doesn't take into consideration the common desire to escape and feel free that many divers hope to experience through diving, making them feel restricted?

Thanks

Paul

 

[DameDykker]

We mostly use body lines to keep a distance of max 4 meters. And a quick way of communication. Works very well here where the visability often is rather low 0-6m.

But I also have had bodys that were just a glance a way at all times - no hassle.

But I also agree that you have to be prepared to solo dive in pairs.

 

[jbd]

Running out of air--redundancy ie pony bottle doubles with isolation manifold etc. Or in my case shallow dives with full knowledge that I can reach the surface with little if any problem safely.

Cramps--prevention first. You must know what triggers cramps. then you must be able to relieve a cramp your self.

Heart attack--more then likely your buddy won't be able to do you much good here anyways. Granted with a mild attack maybe they could get you to shore or to the boat.

A need to be towed--Mostly this is from exhaustion. You relax and dive easy. You don't put yourself in exhausting situations.

I think a key to solo diving is to be fully globally aware of what is asd isn't around you at all times pre-dive; during the dive and post dive.

I think also that solo divers accept the fact that there is an increase in the risk factor. They do everything they can to make this increase manageable.

 

[Rick Murchison]

Originally posted by Paulb2
Thanks for the feedback it was very interesting.

Which agencies teach solo diving?

From the previous notes it could be understood that not all divers believe the Buddy System is an effective way of dealing with underwater diving problems (I wonder what percentage), and solo divers can be equally well prepared? I would be interested to know how solo divers might tackle the following problems without the aid of a buddy: -

·When under the influence of nitrogen Narcosis
·Running out of air
·Cramp and/or the need to be towed
·A heart attack
(Other suggestions)

What are the main motives for divers to dive solo? Are these motives common amongst most divers (beginners to experienced) to a greater or lesser extent?
Is solo diving to get away from people, to feel less restricted? Maybe the current training system is often ineffective because it doesn't take into consideration the common desire to escape and feel free that many divers hope to experience through diving, making them feel restricted?

Thanks

Paul

SDI/TDI (Bret Gilliam) teaches solo diving.

Solo diving as a "safer way to dive" has its philosophical roots in the perceived incompetency of the typical "buddy." The dedicated solo diver generally believes that (1) training, planning, caution and redundancy will cover most, if not all, problems, (2) the increased risks of entrapment or incapacitation are less than the risks presented by the distractions and potential hazards of the typical "buddy" [in extreme cases of "soloitis" the proponent will say "I'm not as safe when I have to keep track of a buddy as I am when I can concentrate on myself"] (3) Most buddies are dangerous.
However, if we apply the DIR rule [see Uncle Pug & Lost Yooper's posts above] of "Don't dive with [divers with unsafe attitudes]" - and especially if we extend that rule to include ourselves - then all but (1) above fall away, and we must accept that there is increased risk in solo diving due to possible entrapment or an unforeseen incapacitating event (CVA, stroke, injury, for example). Those who would attempt to argue their way out of even those points aren't in touch with reality - and should be left to their own fate - they'd be lousy buddies anyway. But so long as a diver is willing to accept that increased risk then solo diving is just fine with me. I do it myself sometimes when I can't find a buddy.
"Water" and "solo" when mixed are more risky than having someone competent along - indeed, for most activities, almost anything short of totally incompetent will do. This applies to swimming, boating, fishing, sea-dooing, surfing, white-watering... as well as diving. Falling out of a boat underway is no big deal so long as there's someone else in the boat to bring it 'round to pick you up... if you're solo, well...
As to the specifics of teamwork required to manage the risks of any given dive, that's as varied as the diving conditions, objectives and the desires and abilities of the divers involved.
Rick

 

[Starfish]

From what I have read above, most of the divers who have responded are not the newbie (29 dives) that I am, so I thought that I'd post what my philosophy has been.

I dive primarily with one buddy, but follow the same principles no matter who I dive with. Before each and EVERY dive, we check each others gear including each others gauges, making sure we both have all pieces of gear in working order and that we both have shears, knives, signaling devices, etc.

Before EACH dive we run through our plan of diving and make sure we both know where the others octo/2nd is located (obviously we are not DIR divers) within our dive triangle.

Before EACH day of diving we review hand signals and make sure we BOTH have underwater slates for communication.

We ALWAYS stay within 10 feet of each other, and if one expresses an interest to go see something the other follows.

We both ALWAYS have something we can bang on our tank if we are one behind the other in case one gets tangled or wants to move off to look at something.

We also always check when forced to go single file that the other person is following.

We OFTEN check each others air consumption during a dive as well.

When diving in a group, we often check other people on the boat to make sure they have their gear particularly if we know someone is newly emerged from training (we have often reminded other divers to put on their weight belt or turn on a tank as they start to shuffle towards the jump off point).

Only once have we been diving outside a group and with a third person. We treated that third the same way we do each other, checking gear, guages, etc. After the dive we were told by the THIRD to lighten up on checking air consumption and makings sure we were within helping distance if needed. We promptly informed him that that was how we dove, and if he didn't really want buddies then he should dive with someone else!
The Third did dive with someone else on the second dive, but effectively dove solo under the "same water principle."

Some would call my partner and I anal. I call us SAFE.

--Starfish

 

[Ontario Diver]

Paul;

The Buddy system is something that is there for safety. But it is like the Buddy check.... it is one of the first things that get forgotten when new divers get their C-Card. But it still has a place in diving......don't trash a perfectly good rule because some folks don't follow it.

Like Starfish, when I dive with a buddy; I dive WITH a buddy. The degree of separation is a risk management issue with the environment and the reason for the dive. (eg, at 20' in 100 ft vis I don't mind being 20' away, but at 110' on a tangled wreck, it it reach out and touch distance)

As I learn more and keep learning - advanced divers build in safety through equipment redudancy, team planning, situational awareness, single mission goals etc. (That is not to say that I am an advanced diver!)

hope that this helps

 

[MikeFerrara]

When I dive with a diver who is not a good buddy it is a student and I am actively working to modify their habits. When I dive for fun it is usually with my wife or son. We dive shoulder to shoulder.

I am not against solo diving but I am against most of the justifications used to argue for it. If you say you are going to dive alone because you want to and that you accept the additional risk I can buy that. If you tell me you are going to dive alone because of reasons like liability, other divers are bad buddies and solo is safer then you should think more and read Rodale's less. This just my opinion but I see alot of divers and the majority of rec divers shouldn't be without supervision let alone without a buddy.

 

[NINman]

think we are getting away from the oringal question, but again I could be wrong.

Right now I don't have a buddy that I dive with per say but I don't like to dive alone for a couple of reasons:

1. SAFTEY - I am a new diver and yes I do dive with in my limits and our dive profiles do not go beyond our training, I do like the extra feeling of knowing someone is there to help IF NEEDED.

2. The other reason I like to dive with groups or at least 1 other diver is the experience. After the dive I like to talk about what we say, what we are going to do next time. What went wrong, IF ANYTHING, Etc..

3. As for separation, we do the normal routine and checks just like Starfish.


PS: I know I couldn't keep my mouth shut forever.

 

[Uncle Pug]

Originally posted by Starfish
From what I have read above, most of the divers who have responded are not the newbie (29 dives) that I am, so I thought that I'd post what my philosophy has been.

Some would call my partner and I anal. I call us SAFE.

--Starfish

Starfish,
You are on the right track and even with only 29 dives are far ahead of those who are heading in the wrong direction.
I would say to keep doing what you are doing and do not slack off on it....
Keep developing your buddy team and you will both benefit greatly...
Look to add others as competent buddies but not on the same dive.... by this I mean that a threesome is far more difficult to handle correctly and for now should be avoided.... but you want to develop other buddies to dive with as well who have the same philosophy you do (which is excellent BTW.)
Try adding light signals to your buddy skills.... you will probably not have HIDs at this point but a similar thing can be accomplished with a focusable halogen light on a night dive
(that is of course if you are trained to night dive.) At night even a smaller light will allow you to get a feel for passive communication and once you see what that can do you will probably want to get a bigger light for use in the daytime. This has been THE single most significant addition that Shane and I have added to our diving. When the time comes private message me and I will give you guidance on the correct light.

 

[Starfish]

Thank you for the words of encouragement Uncle Pug!

I am also one of those people who checks her tire pressure often to avoid getting a flat (85% of flat tires come from under inflation), listens to the aircrew on safety briefings on an airplane, and has fire extinguishers in her house and car.

I intend to live a long, happy, and safe life.